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Convert group to patch?

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Martin Wynne

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Following on from the topic about building kits on Templot plans.

We would need a method of combining several partial templates into a single entity. We would need a name for such an entity. We would need a listing of such entities, and a whole new set of functions to select them and join them, and maybe curve them. And a means to split them back into their partial templates when necessary. And probably a new file format to contain them.

It's difficult to think about a new concept without having a name for it. So we need that first.

We already have "group" for a transient collection of templates. Words such as "collection", "combination", "assembly" emphasize the multiplicity of the contents rather than the singularity of the whole. We already have background "shapes" and sketchboard "items" and timbering "bricks" and the storage "box".

In the CAD world the usual term would be "block". But literally that suggests rectangularity and thickness, which doesn't seem quite right for this idea. Also it can get confusing if misunderstood as a verb.

Here is my short list of possibles. Do any of these sound right? I'm hoping that it could apply to any assembly of templates, not just say a double-slip kit, which could be moved and aligned as one (you can do that now with groups of course, but only one at a time, created for the purpose), and hopefully curved as one (you can't do that with groups).

Imagine designing a goods yard on a curve, and then needing to curve the whole thing a little bit more, and doing that in one go without starting again from scratch. I think I can see a way of doing such a thing -- which would be worth having quite apart from any consideration of combined partial templates for kit-building.

goods yard mat
goods yard knot
goods yard patch
goods yard footprint
goods yard lump

double-slip mat
double-slip knot
double-slip patch
double-slip footprint
double-slip lump

Any more? I'm currently leaning towards "patch". A dialog called the patch list sounds reasonable. A mouse action to curve patch looks in keeping. A button labelled convert group to patch would be par for the course. :)

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Martin Wynne

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Thanks all for the ideas.

But I was looking for a name which suggests a single entity rather than a container for, or assemblage of, component parts.

Experienced Templot users will know that it is exactly that, but they don't need any new names or functions to handle such a thing.

I want a name for a flat thing which can be picked and plonked on the screen as a single object having a defined area or boundary. Similar to "template" in context and meaning, but different. Also it needs to be a short word. At present I still like "mat" or "patch".

There is also the option of creating a new word (which is a good option for Google searching) such as "templan" or "railmat" or "trackchunk". Or "glom"!

(John, "set" is out because it is already in Templot with the alternative meaning of something being adjusted and fixed, see also:

set.png

)

However, it has dawned on me that

a) it's summer and the sun is shining, and

b) it is ages since I did any work to progress the 3D chairing and I must get back to it

so now might not be the time to get distracted into an entirely new area of computer programming. :)

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Martin Wynne

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How about 'Tile' ?

Hi John,

Thanks, I thought about "tile" and it is close to the required meaning (although tiles are rarely used at an angle).

But we already have tiled maps, see:

https://85a.uk/templot/companion/get_map_from_the_web.php

and it's important not to leave the slightest room for confusion. We need a word which doesn't mean anything else anywhere in Templot.

I'm desperate to avoid getting involved in explanations which have to untangle misunderstandings and folks getting the wrong end of the stick. Every time I do something new in Templot my first thought is "how will I explain this?". There are several functions in my own development versions which I have never released because it would just be too much work to explain them. Over and over again until the end of time, in the case of anything I write on RMweb. :(

Already the 3D Plug Track is approaching peak-explanation-complexity and there is still a long way to go. The instructions for the custom chairing definitions are going to be horrendous. In fact I may never release that option simply to avoid having to explain it.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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So if you want to discount words like "assembly" and "clutch" as they imply a group of things, how about "Rug"?
It is an entity but can come in different sizes, and is a short word :)
 
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Martin Wynne

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So if you want to discount words like "assembly" and "clutch" as they imply a group of things, how about "Rug"?
It is an entity but can come in different sizes, and is a short word :)
@Steve_Cornford

Hi Steve,

Thanks. If you look in my short list I already have "mat". :)

I'm still tending towards "patch", but wondering about card, coin, token, ticket.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Hi Martin

As I have read through this thread some possibilities came to mind:

assemblage - fairly obvious but a little bit of a mouthful
clump - seems a bit inelegant and possibly more used as a verb

My best suggestion is cluster - worth considering?

Best wishes.
 
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Martin Wynne

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@Bill Campbell

Thanks Bill.

I'm beginning to think I'm heading down a blind alley here. Is this really needed for beginners, or just complication for its own sake? We already have a means to group templates by name tag. Maybe that just needs rescuing from deep in the menus and given its own dialog, with some added automation and explanation.

But I'm going ahead with the option to curve a slip in one go. Because it isn't actually anything new. It just automates a few existing clicks to delete the slip, curve one of the half-diamonds, and then re-create a slip. Likewise for tandem turnouts.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Once upon a time school pupils in Scotland were subjected to the teaching of set theory as part of the Mathematics curriculum in their first year of secondary education. Much was made of intersection and union of sets, not to mention the commutative law and Venn diagrams.

So would subset not be more appropriate?

Regards.
 
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Martin Wynne

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But I was looking for a name which suggests a single entity rather than a container for, or assemblage of, component parts.
@Wayne Kinney

Thanks for all the suggestions. But everyone is getting the wrong end of the stick, so clearly I failed to explain myself properly. I was looking for a word which does not suggest a multiplicity of items, but a single entity in its own right. For example you can put lots of things in a jug, but if you say "a jug" it means a single object, without any suggestion or indication of what it might or might not contain.

However, this is all wasting your time, sorry.

Because after 3 weeks, several walks, and the floor covered in wrobbled-up pieces of paper, I am no nearer to a solution. And I've been here at least twice before over the years.

There simply isn't a way which pick-and-place methods can be merged into Templot's existing methodology so that you can move seamlessly between them. Not without adding a lot of new functions and constructs -- making Templot more complex instead of less. As it stands it works fine and doesn't need any additional complexity, with many folks believing it is already too complicated.

The solution must be to make a better job of explaining Templot, so that no-one has any desire to use pick-and-place methods -- or if they do, they go off and use AnyRail instead. Wayne is rapidly expanding his range of kits, now including two sizes of turnout, plus diamond-crossings and slips. What is needed now is a new topic or web site or blog or book or whatever "Using Finetrax Kits in Templot".

Where such a thing might come from I'm not too clear, but I have added it to my list. :confused:

cheers,

Martin.
 
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