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TEMPLOT 3D PLUG TRACK - To get up to speed with this experimental project click here.   To watch an introductory video click here.   See the User Guide at Bexhill West.

  • The Plug Track functions are experimental and still being developed. Some of the earlier pages of this topic are now out-of-date.

    For an updated overview of this project see this topic.   For some practical modelling aspects of using Plug Track see Building 3D Track.

    The assumption is that you have your own machines on which to experiment, or helpful friends with machines. Please do not send Templot files to commercial laser cutting or 3D printing firms while this project is still experimental, because the results are unpredictable and possibly wasteful.

    Some pages of this and other topics include contributions from members who are creating and posting their own CAD designs for 3D printing and laser-cutting. Do not confuse them with Templot's own exported CAD files. All files derived from Templot are © Martin Wynne.
  • The Plug Track functions are experimental and still being developed.

    For an updated overview of this project see this topic.   For some practical modelling aspects of using Plug Track see Building 3D Track.

    The assumption is that you have your own machines on which to experiment, or helpful friends with machines. Please do not send Templot files to commercial laser cutting or 3D printing firms while this project is still experimental, because the results are unpredictable and possibly wasteful.

    Some pages of this and other topics include contributions from members who are creating and posting their own CAD designs for 3D printing and laser-cutting. Do not confuse them with Templot's own exported CAD files. All files derived from Templot are © Martin Wynne.

Experimental Plug Track: 3D-printed, CNC-milled, laser-cut

Quick reply >
Hi Steve,
That looks fantastic.
Was it supposed to be printed on an FDM printer? As I found a file similar to that on Thinguverse, but it was for a FDM machine, even though it was a STL file type. I had not made the connection that a STL designed for FDM could also be made to work on a resin printer.
Cheers
Phil
 
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Standalone picture
20230415_103938.jpg
Shows the slot that marries IP with the build plate slot & the two M4 nuts & bolts for clamping onto build plate
 
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Hi Phil,
I believe it is designed for resin printing, there are 3 files, I downloaded the chitubox project one which already had supports, then opened in chitubox, at first it looks too large but that is just perspective view.
All I did was slice, save & print.
Be patient as it does not look as though it is printing properly, because of the nest if supports it is not easily visible, but it does, after washing I removed supports before curing.
Steve
 
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Here is the link
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:3895021

That is for version 5 that I printed, but he has a version 9 as well.

designer is psdesign and he has lots of other thingi's

As i have 2 build plates I am going to print a second one.

removing the supports from around the bolt holes was a bit fiddly but the bracket certainly works, just got to give it a couple of scoosh coats!
Steve
 
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Here is the link
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:3895021

That is for version 5 that I printed, but he has a version 9 as well.

designer is psdesign and he has lots of other thingi's

As i have 2 build plates I am going to print a second one.

removing the supports from around the bolt holes was a bit fiddly but the bracket certainly works, just got to give it a couple of scoosh coats!
Steve
@Steve_Cornford

Hi Steve,

This one:

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4430372

seems to a development of that with a slight additional twist in the holder so that one corner of the plate is lower than the other.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Hi Phil,
3895021 is the one I printed, if you read the comments he printed it on a Mars printer, the picture looks like red resin to me.
I just downloaded the 2nd file in list, opened in chitubox , sliced , saved & printed.
Martin has found a slightly different that might be better.
 
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Well I am 4 hours 18 mins into printing the v9 drip bracket, only another 1 hour 27 mins to go!

It's the tallest print I have done so far, just hope I have enough IPA to fully immerse it in the wash tank!
 
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.
Having messed up badly in 237c I'm trying to get back on track for 238a.

A lot of tickboxes have been removed from here:

dxf_238a.png



and reappeared here:

jaws1_238a.png



I unticked the option above to have an inner gauge jaw on all S1 chairs on this template, or an outer jaw on all S1J joint chairs on this template:

jaws_238a.png

What's the good of that? Well not much, normally those 2 columns would be left all ticked. But the new mechanism recreates the previous option to omit individual chair jaws. That might be useful in some complex formations where you want a short partial template with a blank chair base onto which individual cosmetic jaws can be glued after construction. It's going to be a long time before every possible special chair is directly available within plug track.

I'm hoping get 238a done this week. But this time it won't be released until I have tested it thoroughly!

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Hi Steve,
I went with the one Martin highlighted as its angled in both directions,
please see photos note. I have not quite mastered a scooch of paint as you can see
 

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.
For 238a I have moved several tickbox options from the DXF dialog to this menu, where they are template-specific.

If you untick them, you get an explanation and a chance to change your mind:

no_keys.png



In this case, this option makes it easier to create a scenic pile of chairs stacked outside a p.w. hut for example, or as a wagon load. Such items look a bit daft if they have keys in the chairs. Likewise if they have chair screws in them. We can remove the screw heads, but more work is needed on the screw holes: :)

no_keys1.png


cheers,

Martin.
 
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Hi Martin, Just a thought... and I do NOT want to distract You from your imminent release... but, within earlier releases 'I think' you were able to include S1 chairs in the missing crossing/vee areas. Am I imagining this? I know its not prototypical but, I was wondering whether the imminent release would have an option to include/exclude these incorrect chairs or holes or loose jaws as an interim to a full compliment of chairs etc?
1682179080099.png
 
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@Terry Downes

Hi Terry,

I could put them back, but I'm mystified why you want them? They are completely unusable in any way to produce usable track. They caused a lot of trouble to folks wasting time and money laser-cutting for them and so forth. I couldn't understand why anyone would do that, and rather late in the day I removed them until I have the proper chairs done.

Essentially Templot puts an S1 chair everywhere until told to put something else. I was dismayed to find that folks couldn't grasp that when I kept saying the whole thing was still experimental, and seeing the obviously wrong chairs in some places.

Just as an example, all the chairs I have done so far have been square-on to the running rail. Those crossing chairs are different -- they are skewed square to the centre-line of the crossing, and not square to either of the rails.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Hi Martin,
I certainly don't want to distract you from working on 238A,
However your comments to Terry really got me thinking, I have always been of the view you were going to have to make chairs Y,X A,B and C, all cosmetic given there is nothing we can do to grip these to the rails. I.e. there is no key to lock the rail web in place.

On the prototypical railway this issue is addressed by bolting the rails directly together, all be it with cast spacer units. and in the case of the A chair the rail tip looks to bolt though the chair and into the timber.

In a somewhat ironic way the old rivet to timber and solder the rail the rivet, thus holding timber and rail directly are a good way of ensuring the crossing vee can't move overtime. Or do have you some very cleaver trick up your sleeve to address this dilemma?
Cheers
Phil,
 

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@Phil G

Hi Phil,

I'm working on some ideas for the crossing chairs and spacer blocks. I don't want to say too much until I have properly tested them. I'm hoping that there will be no need to solder the vee point and splice rails together -- as on the Finetrax kits (on 3D-printed bases) for example. Provided they have been accurately filed (in the FDM filing jigs?) it should be possible to install them one at a time -- it's true that if soldered up as a one-piece vee it would be very difficult to fit the plug track chairs.

An obvious issue is that we can't use the prototype dimensions because of the wider than scale flangeway gaps, even in P4.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Hi Martin,
Thanks for the reply,
I thought you my have some ideas up your sleeve. Having had a look at the finescale website, he looks to be doing it, by not being truly prototypical, (which at any scale there has to be a compromise), but instead doing it by creating a constringed path for the vee point and the splice rail to slide into, a bit like a locating jig if you like. Which if you did that would have to cover at least the A and B chairs, maybe even the A, B and C chairs,
A key point to his system however, seems to be that the turnout timbers (made from plastic) are pre spaced and bound to each other (same as PECO points for example) that will add positively to the the required strength of the system will it not?
He also talks about super gluing one or two rails on completion, which presumably would also include the wing and check rails given how short they are. so I am assuming the same for the vee point and slice rails.
Are you also thinking about using super glue?

It would also mean every different crossing angle has to generate a different A B and C combination. Thinking about that's true of any system, but the implication are more so. You would also need to create a jig for every crossing angle Templot generated.
Are you planning to do this by using variables inside the Templot programme? Or will it be more of a case of just calling up the required preformed jig (designed) angle. IE more like a library of know jig angles? if the latter I would be very willing to help with that.
cheers
Phil,
 
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It would also mean every different crossing angle has to generate a different A B and C combination. Thinking about that's true of any system, but the implication are more so. You would also need to create a jig for every crossing angle Templot generated.
Are you planning to do this by using variables inside the Templot programme?
@Phil G

Hi Phil,

I'm not sure what you mean there? Every single thing in Templot is generated from variables inside the Templot program. If you design a 1:7.38 V-crossing, that's what plug track will generate the chairs for, and a matching filing jig if you want one.

I am primarily thinking about a solution for FDM printing and CNC milling. Because those are the machines I have here and can test ideas on. How it will work for laser-cutting I'm not so sure, because as far as I know on home machines it is not possible to do even 2.5D work. I confess that I have been rather wrong-footed in the last few months with so much interest in laser-cutting. I assumed originally that FDM printing is so much more user-friendly and affordable than laser-cutting that the majority of plug track users would be going that way. I just don't see a laser cutter in every typical modellers home workshop in the way 3D printing is going, but maybe I'm wrong?

To continue this project I may have to get a laser-cutter myself, but I'm not attracted to the idea. I shall have to find a safe place for it, and build extraction fans and suchlike. A machine which produces clouds of smoke and flames and can blind you if you forget to put the red glasses on is not something I would look forward to working on nowadays. 40 years ago it would have been meat and drink to me, but not now. Also there is the cost of materials to consider, every plywood test print costing money. I have a large box full of scrap test FDM timbering bases. All of which came from a couple of still unfinished reels of filament. How much they would have cost if made from sheets of plywood I don't know, but I know it wouldn't be cheap.

It's just not possible to progress this project without making test prints myself and getting the results immediately. Trying to develop ideas if you have to send tests off to someone else, laboriously trying to explain exactly what you want, waiting ages for the results, and paying for them, is not a cheap fun hobby -- it's too much like working life.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Martin this is great - I am going to print off some chairs this morning on my anycubic....is there an STL for a test Sleeper Section. Appologies in advance if I am missing the obvious.
 
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Hi Phil, hopefully you have had time to test the 3D printed drip bracket for your Mars printer.
During the zoom meeting I think you also mentioned the volume of IPA you were getting through.

To reduce the amount required to cover the build plate in the Mercury wash, o added an extension to the metal bracket so that the build plate can sit lower in the wash so that I can get away with only 1 litre .
20230423_092447.jpg
It is made from a piece of 20mm by 20mm aluminium angle about 12 cm long, with several holes drilled to allow a couple of M4 nuts & bolts to join the two original parts of the bracket.
Steve
 
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@Michael Woods

Hi Michael,

Welcome to Templot Club. :)

Can you clarify? Is that a resin printer or FDM (filament)? i have posted some test files for both in the past, but due to the state of my memory nowadays it is going to take me a while to find them. It would be a lot quicker to make some fresh ones. Or you could make them yourself of course. Perhaps someone else will find and post the links.

If it's an FDM printer you will likely get poor results with the standard printing profiles supplied with the printer. i can post a Cura profile file for the settings I use if wanted. I was intending to do that anyway, but maybe not just yet. This is an experiment still being conducted. :)

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Hi Phil, hopefully you have had time to test the 3D printed drip bracket for your Mars printer.
During the zoom meeting I think you also mentioned the volume of IPA you were getting through.

To reduce the amount required to cover the build plate in the Mercury wash, o added an extension to the metal bracket so that the build plate can sit lower in the wash so that I can get away with only 1 litre .
View attachment 5509
It is made from a piece of 20mm by 20mm aluminium angle about 12 cm long, with several holes drilled to allow a couple of M4 nuts & bolts to join the two original parts of the bracket.
Steve
@Steve_Cornford

Hi Steve,

Elegoo have changed the design of the Mercury washer, so I don't think your attachment will now work unfortunately. The build plate now sits on a non-adjustable wire-frame within the tub, so that washing can be done with the lid on.

To use less IPA it might be possible to put large objects inside the tub around the sides. I haven't got one to try.

If there is still a slot at the top of the column it would be possible to make a home-made bracket to return to the previous adjustable method, but that's probably a big IF.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Hi Martin I will print the chairs on an anycubic resin printer (just started the print). For the sleepers I can use either, I have an anycubic FLM printer that I have my own slicer for so can mess around to get the best result,

I 3D print all my models (using fusion 360 and Tinkercad) so quite excited to see if I could 3D print the layout I am planning. I work in S Scale.

I can have a go at ctreating my own STLs, I have seen some screen shots in these pages but is there a place a beginer can go to for an intro in how to get from template to something that I can pull into an STL?
 
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Hi Michael,
You don't need to pull anything into STL, as Templot can output the required STL, whether for an FDM timberbase or Resin raft of chairs.
If you read this thread from beginning I am sure it will help.
On the export window there are a couple of helpful buttons, [chairs only], [timbers only ] which give set the various parts to suitable defaults.
Then just repair the resultant STL using the link in bottom right of the export screen.
 
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I 3D print all my models (using fusion 360 and Tinkercad) so quite excited to see if I could 3D print the layout I am planning. I work in S Scale.
@Michael Woods

Hold your horses Michael! You can't do that yet because I haven't yet done the crossing chairs. At present you can get only as far as doing the switches and check rails.

index.php


index.php


I have written all this stuff many times, made videos, and discussed it in Zoom meetings, but I'm getting so befuddled now that I can't remember exactly when or in which posts and topics. Hopefully someone else will help me out by posting the links.

There are also several problems in the latest 237c release which I am trying to get fixed and an update released. I spent an entire day on Friday hunting down two silly bugs and I'm still feeling exhausted from it.

Before going any further with making chairs, you have to decide whether you want solid slide-on chairs, or drop-on chairs with loose outer jaws. Lots of pros and cons to consider there.

To start FDM printing the timbering bases, you need to read (all of -- it changers as it goes along) this topic:

https://85a.uk/templot/club/index.php?threads/extracting-a-3d-timbering-brick-from-a-track-plan.295/

But if you are new to Templot as referenced in your B&M topic, it is not going to make much sense yet.

When I've had some breakfast I will post a sample STL for a short bit of timbering base.

The next Zoom meeting is this Wednesday at 8pm. We can talk about this stuff if you wish. Link at the top of this and every page.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Ps you will have to set a custom rail in the right hand box assuming.kng you are using S scale society rail

@Michael Woods

Hold your horses Michael! You can't do that yet because I haven't yet done the crossing chairs. At present you can get only as far as doing the switches and check rails.

index.php


index.php


I have written all this stuff many times, made videos, and discussed it in Zoom meetings, but I'm getting so befuddled now that I can't remember exactly when or in which posts and topics. Hopefully someone else will help me out by posting the links.

There are also several problems in the latest 237c release which I am trying to get fixed and an update released. I spent an entire day on Friday hunting down two silly bugs and I'm still feeling exhausted from it.

Before going any further with making chairs, you have to decide whether you want solid slide-on chairs, or drop-on chairs with loose outer jaws. Lots of pros and cons to consider there.

To start FDM printing the timbering bases, you need to read (all of -- it changers as it goes along) this topic:

https://85a.uk/templot/club/index.php?threads/extracting-a-3d-timbering-brick-from-a-track-plan.295/

But if you are new to Templot as referenced in your B&M topic, it is not going to make much sense yet.

When I've had some breakfast I will post a sample STL for a short bit of timbering base.

cheers,

Martin.
OK Martin I will hold the horses, But I did manage to pull the layout into Meshmixer, red is where there are STL errors that Meshmixer can fix......clearly not a very practical experiment but just interested to see what came out of Templot.
 

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OK Martin I will hold the horses, But I did manage to pull the layout into Meshmixer, red is where there are STL errors that Meshmixer can fix......clearly not a very practical experiment but just interested to see what came out of Templot.
@Michael Woods

Hi Michael,

Please don't call them errors. They are intentional integrity overlaps. The (free) mesh fixer of choice is:

https://www.formware.co/onlinestlrepair

It's very important to me that folks can create plug track without needing any CAD software or CAD skills.

Putting an entire layout in an STL file is a bit daft -- once fixed it will be an enormous file and how on Earth would you print it? :)

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Hi Martin,
I hear what your saying about equipment cost.
just a few thoughts on that one.

Firstly I 100% agree if you go from a diode laser to C02 laser, there is no doubt the quality and maybe the accuracy of the co2 laser is way better.

However as you rightly point out the idea of a home owned Co2 laser is way outside the scope of an individual and maybe even a railway club or group.
I am not yet sure the quality of a diode laser (even the current breed of stacked lasers to give higher outputs)
gives you the level of accuracy required to build a plug track system with the accuracy required to simply plug in the chair.
And then there is the need to enclose ventilate and make sure you don't look directly at it.

Having said that I have just taken ownership if a Masuter pro CNC router and have a laser tree 40W (10W output power laser on order) that was directly from research you started by by an earlier post. ( just started building the enclose today.)
So in the next few weeks I can at least comment.

I have also been in the garage and dusted off my old Ender 3FDM 3D printer.
Full disclosure I was never that impressed with an FDM 3D printer, which is why it's sat gathering dust and cobwebs for a few years now.

I can see, it would work for a small brick concept, the very idea of small timber bricks seems a very long winded way to make track work to me.
I am sure it will work it just strikes me as being just too time consuming to be practical. (that a personal comment and I could be way off the mark.)
I am personally very attracted to the idea of a laser approach to complex timber track work. Where to get accuracy you have to compromise on best use of the wood, and for more simple track design you go for better use of the timber by stacking the timbers.

All of that of course only works if a diode laser can deliver the required accuracy. If not I do agree an FDM printer maybe more practical than out sourcing to a commercial Co2 supplier. ( watch this space) If I am right you may need to invest in a laser :)

I went with the Masuter Pro which is a CNC router not a CNC mill. technically the difference seems to be a CNC mill uses a lead screw and CNC router uses a toothed belt, for the purpose of cutting wood a router should do the job. and its ideal for adding a laser.
To your other point I had assumed Templot generated everything from variables I just wanted you to verify.
Incidentally that's also a good reason to dust off the Ender.
right now the only thing i know for sure is the 3D resin printer is the ideal tool for making your own chairs. :) you nailed that one.
cheers
Phil,
 
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@Phil G

Thanks Phil. Looking forward to your report, but I doubt your situation is typical of most Templot users?

The specific problem for laser cutting and the reason for writing before is the crossing chairs you asked about. My current designs require some 3D effects into the FDM/CNC/resin timbering base, and I'm not sure it will work on laser-cut plywood.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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@Michael Woods

Hi Michael,

Please don't call them errors. They are intentional integrity overlaps. The (free) mesh fixer of choice is:

https://www.formware.co/onlinestlrepair

It's very important to me that folks can create plug track without needing any CAD software or CAD skills.

Putting an entire layout in an STL file is a bit daft -- once fixed it will be an enormous file and how on Earth would you print it? :)

cheers,

Martin.
Thanks Martin, Just experimenting. I have printed some chairs - look fine - just scaling them up now for S Scale. You are correct only a fool would think they could print the whole layout :) I was just looking to see what came out of Templot.


The challenge I have is that when I try and export the control template (turnout) only the create SDL goes grey but when I print the whole trackplan it works - hence sending the track plan to see what was going on. Any clues what I am doing wrong?


I appreciate that you are busy and have better things to do than answer my questions so just ignore if this is too much for a sunday morning.
 

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I have printed some chairs - look fine - just scaling them up now for S Scale.
@Michael Woods

Hi Michael,

???

You set S scale on Templot, and S scale chairs get exported. What do you need to scale up?

To get a good fit on your S scale bullhead rail, you will need to enter the section dimensions as a custom setting on the DXF dialog. As far as I can remember that is working ok.

The challenge I have is that when I try and export the control template (turnout)

You can't export the control template for DXF/STL -- you need to store it as a background template first. If you just want the one template, select it as the only member of a group. Click on it and press G.

The STL option is available only for 3D exports, not 2D.

DXF export is for either.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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