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  • The Plug Track functions are experimental and still being developed. Some of the earlier pages of this topic are now out-of-date.

    For an updated overview of this project see this topic.   For some practical modelling aspects of using Plug Track see Building 3D Track.

    The assumption is that you have your own machines on which to experiment, or helpful friends with machines. Please do not send Templot files to commercial laser cutting or 3D printing firms while this project is still experimental, because the results are unpredictable and possibly wasteful.

    Some pages of this and other topics include contributions from members who are creating and posting their own CAD designs for 3D printing and laser-cutting. Do not confuse them with Templot's own exported CAD files. All files derived from Templot are © Martin Wynne.
  • The Plug Track functions are experimental and still being developed.

    For an updated overview of this project see this topic.   For some practical modelling aspects of using Plug Track see Building 3D Track.

    The assumption is that you have your own machines on which to experiment, or helpful friends with machines. Please do not send Templot files to commercial laser cutting or 3D printing firms while this project is still experimental, because the results are unpredictable and possibly wasteful.

    Some pages of this and other topics include contributions from members who are creating and posting their own CAD designs for 3D printing and laser-cutting. Do not confuse them with Templot's own exported CAD files. All files derived from Templot are © Martin Wynne.

First attempt at printing using a Bambu P1 S

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Vistisen

Member
Location
Denmark
Hi. I'm not sure whether it is a good idea to start a new thread. This is my first atttempt at printing a short section of plain track to test my Bambu P1S printer. I expect that I will have to adjust settings, but I will see what happens using default 0.08 layer settings. This printer is for those who don't know it very easy to use. It is on a my network up in the hobby room. and even has a built in webcam!:

it says that it waill take about 50 minutes
1729179711636.png
 
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Are you printing plug or COT track? If it's COT, have you looked closely at the chairs after slicing? I've just found something strange about Orca Slicer, that is based on Bambu Slicer. See my post in the COT topic. It slices properly in Prusa Slicer, and also in Qidi Slicer that's based or Prusa Slicer, so I'm wondering if the problem is just in Orca Slicer, or if Orca inherited it from Bambu Slicer. This is getting complicated!
 
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I am planning to use my resin printer to print the chairs. So it is plug track. Here is the result of my first test:
1729183241999.jpeg

Strangely my first stl file could not be sliced as it had 'floating elements'. I did a second stl file after clicking a few different checkboxes and the resulting file sliced without problems
 
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Did you perform a mesh fix first?
Yes I did. I have the two stl files, so it any wants to try and see why I can upload them. I work in IT and get fed up when people report problems with no useful information. So I ought have made a note of what differences in export settings I used in the two examples. But as I said at the start, this was just a quick test to see what happens iof I use default settings on the printer
 
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Martin and the other testers are using cheap printers. You've got a good one, and mine is somewhere in between. Let's push boundaries and see if we can do what they say is impossible :).
 
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Martin and the other testers are using cheap printers. You've got a good one, and mine is somewhere in between. Let's push boundaries and see if we can do what they say is impossible :).
@JohnB @AndyB

Hi John,

I didn't say it was impossible. I've made some 4mm COT track here on the Neptune 4. It's ok, but so far behind the resin and injection-moulded 4mm chairs I didn't think I should be recommending it. I found the chairs quite fragile and easily broken when threading rail. Plug track is the way to go in 4mm scale, I don't want to mislead beginners.

But it's a lot better than the 4mm COT track which I tried on a Marlin-based printer 5 years ago. :)

Andrew Barrowman in California has been producing 4mm COT track for several years, using CAD-drawn simplified chairs.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Hi,

Looking good. (y)

Which filament is that?

cheers,

Martin.
Hi Martin,

I'm not sure to be honest. When I bought the printer last autumn, it was included with the printer, according to their website it is Bambus PLA basic.

It has given me really good results, I have only had one failed print. A friend of mine who is a teacher recommended the Bambu printer as a bombproof (childproof), easy to use fdm printer. The reviews I read/saw online all said that the Bambu slicer software is almost boring: Import stl file, click on slice, click on print. No need to worry about modifying settings. This first test was done with no changes to the default settings I have used for everything else done on the printer. It is a doddle compared to my resin Elegoo Mars 3 Pro printer. Which I will now need to go to for the chairs.
 
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I'm not sure to be honest. When I bought the printer last autumn, it was included with the printer, according to their website it is Bambus PLA basic.
HI,

I think you will need to change to toughened PLA-Plus for the filing jigs.

Martin.
 
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HI,

I think you will need to change to toughened PLA-Plus for the filing jigs.

Martin.
I will buy some when I get that far. I was surprised that even this first attempt could actully cope with me pushing rails into it, a few of the chairs snapped 6 out of 32. To be honest I think that most of them were because the thin nosed pliers knocked them when pushing rail in. I have found the zoom meeting where you show how to create bricks, so I might have a go at constructing a turnout soon
 
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I will buy some when I get that far. I was surprised that even this first attempt could actully cope with me pushing rails into it, a few of the chairs snapped 6 out of 32. To be honest I think that most of them were because the thin nosed pliers knocked them when pushing rail in. I have found the zoom meeting where you show how to create bricks, so I might have a go at constructing a turnout soon
@Vistisen

Hi Tim,

For FDM COT track you need to "condition" the chairs first. File a short length of rail to a sharp v-point. Push it through the chairs to break any flash or stringing between the jaws. Then remove it and replace it with the finished rail which will slide through them much more easily.

Using PLA-Plus in 7mm COT the chairs are quite tough and not easily broken. In 4mm scale you need to be a bit more careful.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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20250131_121548.jpg


I thought I would show a test print of 4mm COT track as produced by my Bambu P1s with a .2mm nozzle I think that it is pretty impressive. The timber depth has not been changed from what would be needed for Pug track. I could reduce it. But I think that I might end up using separate chairs with loose jaws for the areas of the point that would otherwise require me to push angled bits of rail through the attached chairs ( check rails and knuckles on the wingrails) If I do than them I will need to need the timbers deep enough for these sockets.

I have used PVA+

I deliberately chose to do things at the optimal settings so it took a long time to print

0.06mm layers with ironing on all top surfaces. This was done using the classic wall generator. It took about two hours to print. One of the options I could play with is the variable layer height so that it is only the chairs that have the thinnest layers.
 
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@Vistisen @Hayfield @James Walters

Hi Tim,

Looking good. (y)

It took about two hours to print.

For how many timbers?

Have you tested the clearance for 00 RTR wheel flanges on the inner jaws?

Before anyone rushes ahead to get a Bambu printer, I should perhaps add that there will be a whole lot of fresh settings and options for 4mm/ft COT track in the next Templot update soon (556b), using a Neptune 4 printer with standard 0.4mm nozzle:


4mm_cot_samples1.jpg



For the THIN option that took about 44 minutes to print (i.e. about 3 minutes per timber average for pointwork -- plain track is faster).

For the MEDIUM option that took about 56 minutes to print (i.e. about 4 minutes per timber average for pointwork).


4mm_cot_samples2.png



The same slicer settings allow the printing of plug-in 4mm/ft chairs in FDM (but not with loose jaws). Which could be used in laser-cut timbers, instead of resin.

All this will be in the next program update soon. The THICK option (not shown) matches 4mm/ft plug track and allows hybrid construction with mixed slide-in COT and plug-in chairs, in resin or FDM.

There are dozens of related settings and buttons to click, and I'm having trouble condensing them down to some simple one-click pre-sets. It's best NOT to use the existing slicer settings for FDM plug track, and definitely not any of the standard profiles which come with the printer. Getting this latter point across to new users will be the usual battle of wits.

p.s. I shall be posting a suggested Cura profile for 4mm COT track. Do not use it for conventional plug track timbering. The downside of the chair settings mean the timber sides and ends are a bit rough -- as you can see in the photo above. It's not too important because they get hidden in the ballast. Also the socket walls for hybrid track, but they get filled with chairs. But the existing profile for plug track timbering bricks produces neater results.

cheers,

Martin.
 
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I have tested with both new modern RTR wagons and some old Lima coaches with 'pizza cutter' rims. Both work fine. in fact the Lima stock runs better than on the C&L bullhead Flexitrack that I have used up til now, where you can hear a them bumping on each chair.
The other point is whether it is the change to PVA+, or the change in nozzle size, but compared to my first attempt, these chairs have no trouble accepting rails, with no breakages at all. The rails are held firmly in place, but can be moved, and they are vertical with none of the problems that I and others have had with inclining rails using resin prints. Although I have now also sorted that problem out by properly calibration og my MArs 3Pro printer

My test piece of straight track is 15 timbers which took 2.3 hours, so that works out at about about 9.25 minutes per timber... which is very slow, But the idea was to see just how good a finish I could get. I have tried the same print with variable layer thiclkness that took 1.9 hours or 7.6 minutes på timber. But there is a noticable difference in quality. The first print had 92 layers, the second had 68. Obviously using the new thiner timbers will reduce the number of layers and decrease the time. But to be honest I can start a print before going to work, With the bambu I can even see it printing via en webcam on my phone while at work, and it will be finished when I get home.
 
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@Martin Wynne this is fantastic and I'm delighted you (hopefully) had fun coding this functionality. Although I am worried this will encourage more people who don't understand your intent and cause a battle of wits in here. I've learnt if you're happy then just leave you be 😅

Side note to anyone reading this- I'd like to echo your point about Bambulab printers. If you're more open source minded I'd reccomend you do your research.
 
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The 0.4 vs 0.2 mm nozzle thing is interesting, on face value the 0.2 nozzle and a lower layer height should make anything made on an FDM printer closer to the fidelity you can get from a resin process.
The issue will likely be more about getting the 0.2 nozzle settings optimized. Given there is more going on in the way the plastic flows though a smaller nozzle, not least because the area of the 0.4 is a shade over 4 times as much that of the 0.2 nozzle.
It remains to be seen if thats the case.
All very interesting experimentation though.
Cheers
Phil
 
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The 0.4 vs 0.2 mm nozzle thing is interesting, on face value the 0.2 nozzle and a lower layer height should make anything made on an FDM printer closer to the fidelity you can get from a resin process
@Phil G @Vistisen @James Walters

Hi Phil,

The critical setting for getting fine detail from FDM is not the nozzle diameter. It's the line width.

Normally the line width is set the same as, or very close to, the nozzle diameter. But it doesn't have to be -- you can draw a narrow line with a wider nozzle by reducing the flow rate. What you lose in the process is the dimensional placement accuracy. What you gain is much faster speed than would be possible with a tiny nozzle, and much better fusing of the layers for strength.

So it's a trade off between speed/strength and strict accuracy.

For the 4mm COT track with a 0.4mm nozzle I have set a much reduced line width of 0.25mm:

4mm_cot_settings.png


Cura is showing this in yellow because it takes a dim view of the idea. However the Cura programmers obviously are not modelling track in 4mm/ft scale. It does actually work, and allows us to print strong chairs which fit the rail nicely (after a few "corrections" to the dimensions), and at sensible speed.

Cura is the only slicer I have found which will allow such a big discrepancy between nozzle diameter and line width. Other slicers (which are mostly based on the Slic3r code, e.g. Bambu) won't permit such a big discrepancy. Which is a shame because they have the variable layer settings which are not available in Cura.

All of which means I have returned to Cura after much faffing about. I'm pleased with the results I'm now getting from this -- using the Neptune4 with standard 0.4mm nozzle, and PLA+ filament. For best results the filament needs to be dry, and some adjustment may be needed on the touch pad to the flow rate, to match an individual extruder and the measured filament diameter. Only trial and error can determine this.

This also has the advantage that there is no need to change the standard nozzle, which on the lower-cost printers such as the Neptune4 is not simple. And would need to be changed back for the filing jugs.

One effect of the reduced dimensional accuracy is on vertical surfaces, such as the sides and ends of the timbers and the socket walls. They are noticeably more rippled than using the previous profile settings for plug track timbering bricks. So that's another trade-off if you want 4mm COT track in FDM. Given all that gets hidden in the ballast I think it's acceptable.

I wasn't intending to explain all this stuff until I had got it actually released and fully tested, but Tim has somewhat forced my hand. :)

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Cura is the only slicer I have found which will allow such a big discrepancy between nozzle diameter and line width. Other slicers (which are mostly based on the Slic3r code, e.g. Bambu) won't permit such a big discrepancy. Which is a shame because they have the variable layer settings which are not available in Cura.

Just had a very brief look at Orca slicer's X1C pre-sets and I think I can make something happen with the 0.4 nozzle. Proof is in the pudding though..... (ignore the model, something I found on Makerworld, just for demonstration of the slicer)

1738440085672.png



1738439854643.png
 
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@Martin Wynne

OK, Using Orca slicer, X1C pre-sets with 0.4mm nozzle, 0.08 layers with 0.2 line widths and my prints kept failing. I've now moved up to 0.25 line width (as you said Martin) with 0.16 layer lines. I'm printing a piece of straight plain track diagonally across the build plate- so far so good, initial layer has gone down fine and we're printing the model. Overall build time should be 1hr 30 mins.

This came at a good time, I crashed my tool head into the build plate this weekend because I forgot to remove a completed model before printing again and subsequently bent my 0.2mm nozzle! doh!

Edit post processing. Left is 0.4 set to 0.25 line width; one on the right was set to fine with a 0.2 nozzle. Both in Orca slicer. Will try Cura next. Chairs are awful on the 0.4 set to 0.25 and rather annoyingly Cura doesn't seem to support Bambulab- which is fine and no ones fault. (whish I had been more observant with my 0.2mm nozzle now!)

20250203_213640.jpg


edit again, sorry. Found this which is really helpful :)

1738619500058.png
 
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Hi Richard,

Is your modelling period quite early? As I notice you're making inside keyed track panels.
Hi phil,

No idea if I'm honest but I welcome your experience if I need to correct my selections. I plan to model 1970-1989 on the Cumbria coastline.

(These prints are just test prints so no harm)
 
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Richard,

On using my tablet and able to easily enlarge the image, I can see that they are correctly oriented and the keys are on the outside.
 
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