What's on my workbench

Hayfield

Member
Location
Essex
Its been suggested that I start a thread on a project I am working on, this is something that uses code 83 flatbottom rail with Peco Pandrol clips. its a representation of a small section of Clapham junction (north west end) and owing to a lack of trade support is a best effort using the parts available

330.jpeg


My usual method is to build on a flat board, this one is the rear of a clip together flooring 4' x 1' of composite material. I tape the template to the board with masking tape, then cover it with thick tracing paper. I then cut thin strips of double sided tape so I can attach sleepers and timbers at both ends.

331.jpeg


I am using Exactoscale plastic timbers which are 1.6mm thick, sleepers are cut down (this formation is to 00-SF gauge) from one of the Exactoscale 8'6" track panels and I have removed the locating pins. You can see that the 3rd timber from the toes are missing, these will be the hidden tiebars

Sorry its not one for the rivet counters or armchair warriors.
 
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Andrew Duncan

Member
Location
Reigate
Hello John
I'm really pleased you took up Rob's suggestion and am looking forward to seeing more. I went to school at Emanuel School which itself lies between the peninsula formed by Brighton and Portsmouth lines running south out of Clapham Junction. Strongly disliked the school but always enjoyed the train journey....well on the way back at any rate.

So you say north west so in the platform 1-4 ish area...lines to Olympia bit? Are you planning a particular era or taking a more flexible approach? In fact when you mentioned on Yeovil thread that you'd sourced a correct flat bottomed rail it made me think that I'm sure a number of people around here would want to know where.

Kind regards
Andrew
 
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Hayfield

Member
Location
Essex
Hello John
I'm really pleased you took up Rob's suggestion and am looking forward to seeing more. I went to school at Emanuel School which itself lies between the peninsula formed by Brighton and Portsmouth lines running south out of Clapham Junction. Strongly disliked the school but always enjoyed the train journey....well on the way back at any rate.

So you say north west so in the platform 1-4 ish area...lines to Olympia bit? Are you planning a particular era or taking a more flexible approach? In fact when you mentioned on Yeovil thread that you'd sourced a correct flat bottomed rail it made me think that I'm sure a number of people around here would want to know where.

Kind regards
Andrew
Andrew

I may have been a bit misleading with my comments as the rail was referring to a mistake I made, flatbottom track is a real minefield, its an interpretation, especially as the Peco Pandrol clips are a bit overscale, but given the majority of 00 gauge modellers are happy using H0 scale track its a step in the right direction

The rail is the EMGS code 83, I assume it is correct but it is what is asked for. As for me saying" its correct" was that a while back when making something else I ordered some EMGS code 83, but they supplied code 75 bullhead, in error I paid little interest and started building a turnout when Martin suggested I was using the wrong rail. I should have noticed but I had a lot going on at home at the time.

I may have my geography wrong, but I thought platform 1 is on the eastern side ,I think from memory its platform 14 but I could just as well have got it round the wrong way, the layout owner is building part of the station, but I don't know how much of the station is being built and I could only find a map with an earlier layout, so a bit of guess work had to be done, plus fitting the area allocated for it

I think its the end of steam early diesel era,
 
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Hi John,
Thanks for starting this topic, great to see what you are doing.

Can you measure the head width of the EMGS code 83 rail you recently ordered and let me know ? I was very surprised to get an ordre from John at EMGS stores last week as the code 83 he sent had a correct ( for UK ) 0.9mm head width. I had assumed it would be the same narrow ( 0.7mm ) head width as the C&L FB rail that Phil sells. Either way I need both as the 0.7mm is just the job for my US plans - with some new gauges to fit.

Rob
 
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Hayfield

Member
Location
Essex
Rob

Using my cheap calliper its 0.93 mm

C&L do not sell code 83 but code 82

I think I have both Peco code 82 & 83 in my box as well

The EMGS code 83 just about fits the Pandrol clips
 
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Andrew Duncan

Member
Location
Reigate
Andrew

I may have been a bit misleading with my comments as the rail was referring to a mistake I made, flatbottom track is a real minefield, its an interpretation, especially as the Peco Pandrol clips are a bit overscale, but given the majority of 00 gauge modellers are happy using H0 scale track its a step in the right direction

The rail is the EMGS code 83, I assume it is correct but it is what is asked for. As for me saying" its correct" was that a while back when making something else I ordered some EMGS code 83, but they supplied code 75 bullhead, in error I paid little interest and started building a turnout when Martin suggested I was using the wrong rail. I should have noticed but I had a lot going on at home at the time.

I may have my geography wrong, but I thought platform 1 is on the eastern side ,I think from memory its platform 14 but I could just as well have got it round the wrong way, the layout owner is building part of the station, but I don't know how much of the station is being built and I could only find a map with an earlier layout, so a bit of guess work had to be done, plus fitting the area allocated for it

I think its the end of steam early diesel era,
Hello John
Its been a long time since I stood at Clapham Junction waiting for the train (4VEP or CEP if I recall the classification correctly?) to take me home, and I seem to recall it being platform 13 but I could be wrong? But any way platform numbers are of but fleeting interest in this context. I'd love to see your plan when you have a moment. Talking of loco's I recall the Warships going through on the Portsmouth line, sounding as I think Warships always did, as though they were about to break down. Great memories.

Kind regards
Andrew
 
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Hayfield

Member
Location
Essex
Andrew

Sadly this is my plan, I was sent some photos from the correct era, I then uploaded the 1910 (or close to it) into Templot. The plan differed both from the Photos of that era, current photos and Google earth. Looking at the plan and photos + Google earth I was able to make a close approximation to what was required. Then a few PDF's flowed back and forth to adapt to what was required.

As I said a bit of modellers licence rather than an exact replica

I used to go to Paddington as much as I could to see Westerns and Warships. Don't laugh I have one of each to build from MTK kits. indulge my interest in whitemetal kits,
 
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Hayfield

Member
Location
Essex
I have done a bit more today, finished building the common crossings, then fitted them. I have 2 short sections of plain track, thankfully they are not causing building sequence issues.

333.jpeg


The flatbottom rail needs a bit of extra work than bullhead where the switch starts, so I build the switch rails first then match them to the stock rails for a flush finish
334.jpeg


I am thinking as I go along my next 2 or 3 moves, especially as the board is 4' long and not easily spun round
 
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Tony W

Member
Location
North Notts
Hi Andrew.
I would be surprised if the Warships out of Waterloo were on the Portsmouth trains as they were generally used on the west of England services to Exeter. I had several trips behind them to visit relatives in Axminster and can vouch from personal experience that do break down occasionally.

Regards
Tony.
 
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Hello John,

Good work so far. Some close up shots of the checkrail and crossing areas when you have time and have got that far. One of my plans requires a mix of BH and FB lines and I am undecided what to use for the flat bottom bits. The ( slightly overscale ) Pandrol clips look quite good to my eyes but it will be interesting to see how you get on chopping up bases for these areas.
Rob
 
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Martin Wynne

Admin
Location
West of the Severn UK
Info
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Enjoy using Templot?
Thanks.

Please do not send requests for help direct to me via email.

Post your questions on the forum where everyone can see them and add
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Looking good John.(y)

A tip for anyone wanting to zoom in on smaller images on here. Ctrl+click on them. They will open in a fresh tab, and can then be zoomed in the usual way using Ctrl+Roll on the mouse wheel.

If you just click on them, they open in the lightbox and won't zoom.

Martin.
 
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Hayfield

Member
Location
Essex
Hello John,

Good work so far. Some close up shots of the checkrail and crossing areas when you have time and have got that far. One of my plans requires a mix of BH and FB lines and I am undecided what to use for the flat bottom bits. The ( slightly overscale ) Pandrol clips look quite good to my eyes but it will be interesting to see how you get on chopping up bases for these areas.
Rob
Rob

I have mixed code 75 bullhead and code 82 flatbottom in the past using either the plastic or metal functional Exactoscale fishplates, C&L now do both

As for fixings you are limited to either Peco's Pandrol or C&L ST base plates. Another possible alternative are the fixings that come with the Peco concrete sleepers IL-121 I have no idea if Peco will sell these separately

Sadly the common crossings are very basic as are the check & switch rails, unlike the bullhead chairs special chairs a non existent. I add a few bits from spares. The crossings themselves are made up in the standard way using 4mm x 0.6 copperclad strip.

I will upload a few photos later
 
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Hayfield

Member
Location
Essex
Rob

A close up of one of the unfinished common crossings
335.jpeg


I am using the Exactoscale (H section) fishplates to join and insulate the switch rails from the common crossing

Picture 1977.jpg
Picture 1978.jpg


A couple of older photos showing a common crossing assembly prior to installation, first picture shows the copperclad strips before trimming flush
 
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Tony W

Member
Location
North Notts
I used to go to Paddington as much as I could to see Westerns and Warships. Don't laugh I have one of each to build from MTK kits. indulge my interest in whitemetal kits,
Hi John.
I have an MTK kit for a NBL type 2 and that won't get made either.

On the subject of track, I am currently making some Flatbottom track including some pointwork, but in S4 rather than 00. You have an advantage over me in as much as far less of the foot needs to be removed in areas such as the crossing and check rails.
I don't think BR turnouts were made with much other than ST baseplates or Pandrol clips until relatively recently. My project is also a mixture of Bullhead and Flatbottom track as was often the case in the 1960s. I shall follow your efforts with some interest.
I have been documenting my project in some detail on the Scalefour Society forum but have been concentrating mainly on the plain FB track up to now, having almost completed all the BH track, although that will soon change as I have a small batch of turnouts and a single slip to construct in FB using my prefered method of ply and rivet construction, so a slightly different approach.

Regards
Tony.
 
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Last edited:

Andrew Duncan

Member
Location
Reigate
Rob

A close up of one of the unfinished common crossings
View attachment 318

I am using the Exactoscale (H section) fishplates to join and insulate the switch rails from the common crossing

View attachment 319View attachment 320

A couple of older photos showing a common crossing assembly prior to installation, first picture shows the copperclad strips before trimming flush
Thats really nice looking John. Did you say it's Martins 16.2mm gauge and so has 0.8mm flangeways? because it really looks the part. Surprising the difference 1.0mm and 0.8mm make visually if I've understood correctly.
Andrew
 
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Martin Wynne

Admin
Location
West of the Severn UK
Info
.
Enjoy using Templot?
Thanks.

Please do not send requests for help direct to me via email.

Post your questions on the forum where everyone can see them and add
helpful replies.
Thats really nice looking John. Did you say it's Martins 16.2mm gauge and so has 0.8mm flangeways? because it really looks the part. Surprising the difference 1.0mm and 0.8mm make visually if I've understood correctly.
Andrew
Hi Andrew,

I don't possess a gauge. :)

The 00-SF standard is for 16.2mm track gauge with 1.0mm flangeways ("EM minus 2"), see: https://85a.uk/00-sf

It's not mine, it was invented by Roy Miller in the1970s.

There is also a standard called EM-SF for 18.0mm track gauge with 0.8mm flangeways. I believe Rob is having a go with it. I think John may have built something in it too -- he builds everything. :)

cheers,

Martin.
 
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Hayfield

Member
Location
Essex
Hi John.
I have an MTK kit for a NBL type 2 and that won't get made either.

On the subject of track, I am currently making some Flatbottom track including some pointwork, but in S4 rather than 00. You have an advantage over me in as much as far less of the foot needs to be removed in areas such as the crossing and check rails.
I don't think BR turnouts were made with much other than ST baseplates or Pandrol clips until relatively recently. My project is also a mixture of Bullhead and Flatbottom track as was often the case in the 1960s. I shall follow your efforts with some interest.
I have been documenting my project in some detail on the Scalefour Society forum but have been concentrating mainly on the plain FB track up to now, having almost completed all the BH track, although that will soon change as I have a small batch of turnouts and a single slip to construct in FB using my prefered method of ply and rivet construction, so a slightly different approach.

Regards
Tony.

Tony

Yes its a bit easier in 00 gauge, when I am doing larger stuff I have one of these


Absolute no brainer at £30 has so many uses for DIY as well
 
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Hayfield

Member
Location
Essex
Thats really nice looking John. Did you say it's Martins 16.2mm gauge and so has 0.8mm flangeways? because it really looks the part. Surprising the difference 1.0mm and 0.8mm make visually if I've understood correctly.
Andrew
Andrew

00SF has 1mm flangeways not 0.8mm

I think the confusion lies with me using the Exactoscale 0.8mm check rail chairs, but I do not use them as they are unmodified. I cut one outside chair of each double unit so they only clasp one rail, two middle ones are slid on to the stock rail, two or three are slid on to the check rails. I use the check rail gauge to sent the check rail, which virtually closes the gap on EM & 00SF and nearly does on 00. If you tried this method you will not get anywhere near a 0.8 mm gap as both rails are held in compression in an unmodified double chair

The fact is you can build a common crossing using a check rail chair with the outer part cut off plus a few other standard and L1 chairs (if needed) using a soldered Vee and plastic timbers, but let the solvent cure overnight. It would also work with ply timbers using industrial strength superglue.
 
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Hi John,
Thanks for the pics, looking good. I am guilty of muddying the waters by using EM-SF that has 0.8mm flangeways - I suspect Andrew got the 0.8mm bit from a series of posts on the old forum. In my opinion OO-SF with 1mm gaps looks just fine and runs a whole lot better than other OO variants.

Keep up the good work.

Rob
 
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