Templot Club Archive 2007-2020
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posted: 4 Aug 2010 09:55 from: grog_polymer
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I have followed some articles on this site about different chair types and placement. Is there anything out there that shows pictures of the different chair types and describes their uses? I am absolutely going to get started with PCB pointwork and avoid that question preventing me from starting building track. But I am looking to mix Peco Code 75 flex and haid laid track. Chairs will be obviously missing with this situation so I either need to resolve that or just do PCB everywhere which will increase the build time. Regards, Greg |
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posted: 4 Aug 2010 10:46 from: Nigel Brown click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Hi Greg Do you really want to do that? You can buy code 75 flex track from suppliers such as C & L which is much closer to prototype dimensions, and hence to Templot, which will look much better when finished. You can also buy point kits which will provide chairs and information on how to use them. You could of course construct PCB pointwork and add cosmetic chairs; personally I've found that approach a bit tedious and would suggest using plastic sleepers as per the above kits, or ply sleepers, with the chairs glued to the sleepers. Cheers Nigel |
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posted: 4 Aug 2010 11:08 from: grog_polymer
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My chosen track standard is OO-SF. This was selected to allow fellow BRMA members to bring their RTR stock and run it at my place but not suffer the horrendous running that comes with RTR pointwork with massive flangeways. There will be imperceivable change in gauge where OO-SF P+C meets Peco flex from a gauge perspective. Building some PCB turnouts with limited sleepers drives the cost and time to build way down for staging track but will still give reliable running so that seems a very sensible place to start for my first hand made track work. The OO-SF gauges only arrived today. Good running and breaking away from the fixed constraints of the available pointwork from Peco et al as the primary drivers. Cost cannot be ignored. DCC and a large number of crossings will consume much of the budget. The C+L kits are expensive albeit that they come with gauges that I don't want/need. I intend for one layout to consume most of my 6x5.5m "train room". The layout/s built will reside at my house here in Australia and are not intended for exhibition. Most people in Australia would not have a clue whether the track looked right for the UK. EM + P4 are out due to rewheeling time and costs as well as not meeting the goal of allowing visiting stock. I have a very large anount of stock and other than getting rid of some plastic wheels on a few things - rewheeling is out. Cosmetic chairs sound like what I will look to do but I get back to - I would not know one from another other than plain chairs and slide chairs or where to get them. I asked about cosmetic chairs in another forum and got bah Humbug type responses. So I thought that if I new what I ws looking at then I would be part way to finding what I need. Regards, Greg |
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posted: 4 Aug 2010 11:20 from: Martin Wynne
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grog_polymer wrote:Cosmetic chairs sound like what I will look to do but I get back to - I would not know one from another other than plain chairs and slide chairs or where to get them.Hi Greg, Adding cosmetic chairs to copper-clad track is difficult and fiddly because the rail is flush to the timbers. The moulded chairs are designed to lift the rail above the sleepers by the correct amount to represent the base of the chair castings (1.3/4" thick, 0.6mm in 4mm scale). On copper-clad timbers the chairs are too high to fit the rail and may foul the wheel flanges. More chairing info: message 4620 chairing_patterns.gif  regards, Martin. |
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posted: 4 Aug 2010 11:57 from: grog_polymer
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Thanks Martin (and Nigel who I forgot to thank) I did look at Exactoscale earlier and looked at the individual chairs rather than the turmouts. Are the block chairs the ones that carry the spacing web for the separation of the check rail to the stock rail for example? I can identify Bridge chairs from their narrower footprint in the turnout diagrams but cannot figure out the difference when I look at the individual Exactoscale chair images. Exactoscale say their instructions are in the PDF's of the product but the chair sets just seem to have pictures with lots of different chairs and tell you to look at the instructions to see where they go. I think an email to them may be in order. |
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posted: 4 Aug 2010 12:41 from: Nigel Brown click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Hi Greg Not sure if Exactoscale produce block chairs as such; certainly the check chairs you were looking at are not the ones. You could produce a block chair by taking two bridge chairs and shaving bits off until they fit side by side. Re cost, for turnouts this can be brought down simply by buying the chairs and rail and producing the crossings, switch rails etc yourself. Also if you were to consider plastic sleepers/timbers, then Plastruct or Evergreen strip is an alternative to those produced by Exactoscale, C&L etc Presumably if you're using PCB for the staging turnouts then appearance there doesn't matter too much. Cheers Nigel |
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| Last edited on 4 Aug 2010 12:44 by Nigel Brown |
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posted: 4 Aug 2010 13:41 from: JFS
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Greg, Just a caution about using chairs in 16.5mm I recently built some 00-SF track for a mate (who had fallen off the P4 Wagon by the way). All appeared well but we had trouble with some locos - specifically a Hornby Unrebuilt Bullied Pacific and a class 73 Electro Diesel (current catalogue items) - the wheel flanges clouted the chairs everywhere. And this was using the chairs as intended with ply sleepers. I think you would have big issues with anything involving mixing pcb and chairs. "Visiting stock" and "existing stock" might include some deeper flanges than current standard. My learning from that experience was that "00" is not a standard at all - it is a guage! Full details of all the Exactoscale P&C chairs are available at http://www.exactoscale.co.uk/4mmtrackinst.html and excellent they are as well - though how you would fit them into 16.5mm pointwork I could not say having only used them in P4. Certainly, the check chairs are intended for either P4 or S4 standards. Best Regards, Howard |
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posted: 5 Aug 2010 12:07 from: grog_polymer
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Thanks Nigel and Howard, Everywhere you look in UK outline model railways there is another thing to be compensated for. I do understand why people put up with the sort of running they get from Peco Code 75/100 pointwork. US outline and NMRA standards would seem a wise place to start to avoid all this! But I'm committed with Several thousands of dolars of UK outline stuff that I want to see as a dynamic display! Thanks for pointing things out. If I don't know then I can fall in a hole without seeing it and waste a lot of dollars, effort and heartbeats! Regards, Greg. |
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posted: 5 Aug 2010 16:05 from: JFS
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You're welcome Greg and good luck! Quick update from my mate with the 00-SF - he just told we that in the case of the Hornby Pacific, he eased the back to back out with a bit of gentle btrutality (to the guage) and it now works fine - I don't know how but it did! The ED he rewheeled with Ultrscale wheels and needless to say that is perfect. So all is not lost - just keep at it - but I would suggest you try a few experiments / build a shunting plank or three to see what works before you build a whole layout!!! Best Regards, Howard.  |
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