Templot Club Archive 2007-2020
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posted: 7 Feb 2008 10:13 from: Martin Wynne
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Update: Version 091c remains available ( Click to Download ) if you have a valid Templot lock-release code. However if you have an internet connection on your computer you should upgrade to Templot2 which does not require a lock-release code. Templot2 has many new features since version 091c which is now over 5 years old. Download and more information about Templot2 here: message 10771 February 2008: ( Just a reminder that Templot 091c (not Templot2) needs a default local printer -- not a network printer -- to be able to run. A physical printer is not necessary, only the printer driver is needed. A virtual printer such as a fax driver or PDF generator will do fine. A free PDF printer driver can be downloaded from: http://www.pdf995.com/download.html ) Pug version 091c download: Click to Download n.b. After installing 091c on Windows 7 you may see a message "This program may not have installed correctly". Please ignore this and click the "Cancel" button below the message. This pug includes two new usability features which you may find very handy -- drag panning, and pad views history (see below). If you are upgrading from version 074b or 078e, note that 091c also contains all the many changes in the previous pug version 082d, which you should be sure to read about at: 082d pug changes And the new features introduced in 091b, which you should read about at: 091b pug changes New in 091c: 1. Drag panning. You can now move the pad view simply by dragging it with the mouse. This is essentially the same as using the existing CTRL-F2 (or 2 key) mouse action. But now there is no need to select the mouse action first, you can just grab the pad and move it. A few notes: You can use either the left mouse button, or the middle button (wheel button). If you use the left mouse button you must grab the pad somewhere clear of a background template. And you can't use this method while a mouse action is in force. If you would prefer to disable this feature, untick the pad > zoom/pan options > allow left-button drag panning menu item. If you use the middle mouse button (wheel button) there are no such restrictions. You can grab the pad anywhere you like, which makes this usable even when zoomed in close over a template. And you can use this method to move the pad while your are using a mouse action -- which is very handy. Middle-button drag panning can't be disabled. Dragging with the middle button means pressing the mouse wheel down into the body of the mouse and holding it there while you move the mouse. You can if you wish at the same time roll the wheel to zoom the pad simultaneously while moving it. Note however that zooming cancels any mouse action in force, so if you are in a mouse action, take care not to inadvertently roll the wheel while drag panning. Note that these are conventional button-down drags, unlike the click-move-click CAD-style action for the mouse actions. If you have a programmable mouse, for any of the above to work you need to have the wheel button set for "Middle Click" or "AutoScroll". All the other panning functions are retained, which means that there are now a dozen different ways to pan across the pad, but in testing I've found this new way to be very convenient. The left button is the more intuitive, but the middle button gives you greater flexibility. (The previous wheel panning functions remain available if you prefer -- hold down the CTRL key for that, and click the wheel button to change direction from horizontal to vertical movement.) 2. Pad views history. A "pad view" is a combination of your position on the pad and the zoom setting. Moving about on the pad, or zooming in or out, creates a new view. Templot can now remember pad views, so that you can conveniently return to a previous view. This is very useful when you are working in two places at once, or you want to return to where you were before zooming in. There are two completely independent new mechanisms, both available on the zoom/pan controls dialog: zoom_pan_views_large.png  The 4 numbered buttons are fixed pre-sets which you can set up and return to at any time. Independently of those, Templot automatically keeps a rolling record of the 8 most recent views you have been using. A view is regarded as in use after it has remained static for 5 seconds. You can return to these recent views by clicking the previous view button repeatedly. When you do that, the next view button becomes temporarily enabled, so that you can click back and forth through the recent views. When the view has again remained unchanged for 5 seconds, the current view will be added to the recorded views and the next view button becomes disabled again. While the view is changing, the views panel is displayed in a darker orange colour. When the view becomes static for 5 seconds, the colour returns to normal. If the colour is showing normal, you know that you will be able to return to the current view later (if needed). If the roll box is ticked, you can also move back and forth through the recent views by holding down the SHIFT key and rolling the mouse wheel. If the roll box is unticked, the SHIFT key works as before to make wheel zooming much faster. You may want to read the above explanation carefully again. I doubt much would become clear by the usual "click it and see" method!  Being able to return to recent views is extremely handy, so it's worth getting the hang of it.Comments welcome, as always. I would be grateful if you would give the above new features a good bashing and report any problems. Still on 082d? Here's a list of new features already introduced in 091b:
regards, Martin. |
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posted: 7 Feb 2008 13:02 from: Jim Guthrie
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Martin Wynne wrote: Comments welcome, as always. I would be grateful if you would give the above new features a good bashing and report any problems. Martin, Works fine so far. I particularly like your implementation of View History - could you sell it to Autodesk  I had a small funny when installing over 0.91b. The first time it didn't 'take' and I had to redo the installation. I've searched the hard disk to see if finger trouble had plonked it in another folder, but couldn't find anything. I also note that the previous views are remembered on the next session. Jim. |
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posted: 7 Feb 2008 23:33 from: Jim Guthrie
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Martin, Just found a 'funny' on the layout drawing I'm doing at the moment. Displaying 0 - 2000mm on the horizontal scale on my 1024 wide screen, all my background line shapes display. If I zoom in one notch on the mouse wheel so that the horizontal scale is 0 - 1950mm, a few of the lines disappear, or are truncated. If I zoom back out, they re-appear as normal. I can't remember this happening in 0.91B, and I can't easily check since I over-wrote it this am WinXP Home on a Toshiba Laptop - 1024 x 768. Jim. |
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posted: 7 Feb 2008 23:40 from: Paul Boyd
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Hi Martin I haven't had a proper play yet, but thanks for restoring the "keep bashing return" to get in with multiple monitors - that was the first thing I looked for! The drag panning is also extremely useful - it's just a natural thing to have Cheers Paul |
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posted: 8 Feb 2008 00:51 from: Brian W Lewis
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Hi Martin! That drag panning is something I'd quietly wished Templot would do for ages. Thank you for reading my mind! |
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posted: 8 Feb 2008 00:55 from: Jim Guthrie
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Jim Guthrie wrote: Martin,Martin, I've been doing a bit more messing around and it looks as though the lines which are affected are exactly on a grid line and it looks as though the line(s) and the grid are having a fight for display. One of the lines is a vertical line with the X co-ordinates at 1050.00. I zoomed the view in to approximately real size on the screen and the line had disappeared. I then started nicking down the X value until at 1049.47mm, the line appeared. At 1049.48mm, it disappeared. I also printed out a page covering the line at 1:1 and the line printed OK. Jim. |
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posted: 8 Feb 2008 01:07 from: Martin Wynne
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Jim Guthrie wrote: I've been doing a bit more messing around and it looks as though the lines which are affected are exactly on a grid line and it looks as though the line(s) and the grid are having a fight for display.Hi Jim, I made a change in 091c -- the "grid in front of shapes" option is now on by default. Someone asked for that -- I think it may have been Paul. But there is now an alternative access to the setting at pad > pad grid options > grid in front of shapes menu item (in addition to the tickbox on the background shapes dialog). If you untick one or the other, you should see your line again. Sorry I didn't mention this in my previous email. There are a few other changes too, I will list them all in another message. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 8 Feb 2008 02:09 from: Alan Turner
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Martin Wynne wrote:
it was me and thank you very much for it. It was a nice suprise! The panning is brilliant as well. Alan |
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posted: 8 Feb 2008 02:35 from: Martin Wynne
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Dear all, Here's a list of the changes in 091c: 1. drag panning -- see previous message. 2. pad views: pre-sets* and history* -- see previous message. 3. group > restore group name labels menu item. This restores all the template name labels to their default positions, for example after moving or arranging them. Previously it was necessary to restore each template individually. Now you can restore all the grouped templates in one go. 4. pad > pad grid options > grid in front of shapes menu item. This duplicates access to this setting to save needing to open the background shapes dialog. This option is now changed to be on by default -- this is useful for picture shapes, but for other shapes there may be a conflict with the grid lines. Untick the menu item to return to the previous behaviour.* 5. Custom switches -- the "blade tips exactly on timber centre-line" bug has been fixed (after much head-scratching! ). This affected only NER switches as far as I know.6. Several other minor and cosmetic bugs have been fixed. But I have a list of several more not yet fixed -- left for the next pug. * these settings are not currently saved between sessions, but it's intended that they will be in a future pug. Here's the 091c download link again. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 8 Feb 2008 02:48 from: Martin Wynne
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Alan Turner wrote: it was me and thank you very much for it. It was a nice suprise!Hi Alan, In that case Jim knows who to blame! And apologies to Paul. Glad you like it. It really needs a third option "in front of picture shapes only" which I did look at, but it required a lot of new code and a major change to the way the pad screen is double-buffered. I might try that one day, but other things are more pressing at present. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 8 Feb 2008 04:55 from: Jim Guthrie
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Martin Wynne wrote: Alan Turner wrote:Martin,it was me and thank you very much for it. It was a nice suprise!Hi Alan, I've never felt the need to put the grid in front of shapes and I don't think I ever knew that the option existed.  One small thing that's not world shattering. Is it possible to default to the file name you have loaded when saving a box file so that you can save an updated version without having to either type it in, or search for it in the File/Save dialog box? Templot flags up that the file already exists which would warn you if you don't want to over-write it. Jim. |
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posted: 8 Feb 2008 06:33 from: Martin Wynne
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Jim Guthrie wrote: Is it possible to default to the file name you have loaded when saving a box file so that you can save an updated version without having to either type it in, or search for it in the File/Save dialog box?Hi Jim, Don't get me started on the evils of the Windows Document Model.  Please don't overwrite existing files when saving. Templot keeps a rolling backup so there is no need to save files every few minutes. Save a file only when the storage box contains enough new work to be worth saving. And then create a new file for it. Leave the old ones until you are quite sure that you don't want them -- at the very least for 24 hours. They are not difficult to delete, you can do it without leaving Templot by right-clicking in the File dialogs. Of course it's your computer and if you want to overwrite existing files when saving data, that's up to you. But Templot is not going to do anything to facilitate that. Programs such as AJC Active Backup (highly recommended) have been created to get round the shortcomings of the Windows way of working, but I can't develop Templot on the assumption that everyone is running such software. I know the BOX-FILES folder can get a bit cluttered, but at least you know all your work is there if needed. The recent files list is the way to quickly find your current work, and the button for that is the first on the left on the program panel window (formerly the control room) at start-up. Even if I didn't feel so strongly about it, it would be difficult to implement in practice. In Templot you don't open a file, you load data from it. You can have data from a dozen different files loaded into the storage box at once. How would Templot know which file name to suggest when saving? regards, Martin. |
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posted: 8 Feb 2008 13:47 from: Jim Guthrie
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Martin Wynne wrote: Jim Guthrie wrote:Martin,Is it possible to default to the file name you have loaded when saving a box file so that you can save an updated version without having to either type it in, or search for it in the File/Save dialog box?Hi Jim, After I pressed the send button, I had a memory that this topic might have cropped up before and it elicited a similar response from you In my business we use the Windows facility to assist in keeping filenames in an orderly manner and use the 'sticky' filename to either overwrite a file or version it by editing a numerical or alphabetic suffix. We deal with thousands of files in a directory and keeping them in good sorting order is a must or you could spend a lot of time looking for material. However, I concede that it is a discipline that might not come easy to a (comparatively) casual user. Also my main business application also changes the previous version of a file to a backup version so that you have a rescue path after an "Oh Sh*t" moment. I've now done a fair bit more work on the new version and the new View and Pan facilities are excellent - almost worth a numeric change in the version number. Jim. |
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posted: 8 Feb 2008 23:47 from: Paul Boyd
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Martin wrote:In that case Jim knows who to blame!I was beginning to wonder if I really wanted that! I think I much prefer the "off" default. It would be handy for picture shapes, but I "lost" loads of my baseboards under the grids! |
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posted: 9 Feb 2008 00:53 from: Martin Wynne
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Paul Boyd wrote: I was beginning to wonder if I really wanted that! I think I much prefer the "off" default. It would be handy for picture shapes, but I "lost" loads of my baseboards under the grids!Hi Paul, Hmm. Maybe I have made a change too far? As an alternative to switching the "grid in front" option off, you could try (on the background shapes dialog) doing font/colours tab > pad shapes line width > 2. Perhaps I should look more seriously at a "grid in front of picture shapes only" option. p.s. if you build your baseboards in feet and inches, and have the grid in mm, you won't have the problem. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 9 Feb 2008 11:04 from: Jim Guthrie
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Martin Wynne wrote: p.s. if you build your baseboards in feet and inches, and have the grid in mm, you won't have the problem.Martin, And I've just got used to working to the Templot Metric foot - i.e. 300mm = 1ft Jim. |
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posted: 9 Feb 2008 14:53 from: Alan Turner
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Martin Wynne wrote: Hmm. Maybe I have made a change too far? No you haven't!! Alan |
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posted: 9 Feb 2008 18:02 from: Paul Boyd
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Alan wrote:No you haven't!Oh yes he has The "grid in front of pictures only" option does sound like a good idea though. (Idly wonders when these settings will be able to be saved ) |
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posted: 9 Feb 2008 22:47 from: Martin Wynne
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Paul Boyd wrote: (Idly wonders when these settings will be able to be savedHi Paul, The grid spacing settings are currently saved in the box file, so it would seem logical for these to join them, even though it's probably not the best place. Ditto the pre-set pad views. That being so, they can go in when the version number next bumps. And no, I don't know when that will be.  regards, Martin. |
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posted: 10 Feb 2008 06:40 from: Peter Salathiel
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Hi Martin, The new screen controls are excellent. A great help; thank you. Regretfully, something seems to have gone wrong with 'background shapes' in 91c. I have created lines and they appear only when clicked on After saving the file the lines will appear in 91b but not 91c. So it's back to 91b for me Best Regards Peter |
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posted: 10 Feb 2008 09:46 from: Martin Wynne
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Peter Salathiel wrote: something seems to have gone wrong with 'background shapes' in 91c.Hi Peter, Untick the pad > pad grid options > grid in front of shapes menu item. See the previous messages about this. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 10 Feb 2008 20:00 from: Peter Salathiel
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Thanks Martin. I hadn't made the mental connection. Everything OK now. Best Regards Peter |
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posted: 13 Feb 2008 00:51 from: richard_t
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Nice update |
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posted: 13 Feb 2008 13:47 from: Gordon S click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Thanks for incorporating the drag screen facility Martin...very happy. Couple of beginner questions though. When working on the screen, I may open a particular file to work on and at the end of the day want to save all my work. If I have been saving during the day, say version 1, 2, 3 etc, I can't recall which one I should overwrite, because I can't see on the pad the name of the file that I'm currently working on. Apologies if this is the wrong way of working, but it would help to see the file name somewhere on the screen. Of course it's probably there but I haven't noticed it... The second thing relates to pad name labels, which I generally switch off as they make reading the screen difficult on a complex design. Even though I save the file with them off, reopening the file puts them back on. No big deal, but is it possible to set the on or off in the file rather than auto default on at present. Thanks as ever for a great product. Hoping to see my terminus design full size for the first time this week. |
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posted: 13 Feb 2008 16:35 from: Martin Wynne
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Gordon S wrote: Couple of beginner questions though. When working on the screen, I may open a particular file to work on and at the end of the day want to save all my work. If I have been saving during the day, say version 1, 2, 3 etc, I can't recall which one I should overwrite, because I can't see on the pad the name of the file that I'm currently working on. Apologies if this is the wrong way of working, but it would help to see the file name somewhere on the screen. Of course it's probably there but I haven't noticed it... Hi Gordon, Please don't overwrite existing files. Always create a new one -- Templot suggests a suitable unique file name. Delete old files when the project has been finalised. See my previous reply to Jim at: topic 330 - message 1864 However, you can see the name of the most recent file to or from which templates were saved, reloaded or added, on the top line of the storage box dialog: storage_box.png  (showing a file recently added). The storage box is at main > storage box... menu item (version 091) or control > storage box... menu item (earlier versions). The second thing relates to pad name labels, which I generally switch off as they make reading the screen difficult on a complex design. Even though I save the file with them off, reopening the file puts them back on. No big deal, but is it possible to set the on or off in the file rather than auto default on at present. Sorry, that setting (and a great many others) isn't saved at present. Many users have asked for settings to be saved, but it is not the simple matter it might appear. One day, maybe. In the meantime it's very easy -- just dab the END key to show or hide the template name labels as required. When working on partial templates you do need to see them. Note that if the labels are in the way, there is a function to arrange them all in neat rows or columns in a blank are of the pad (and those positions will be saved). See: http://www.templot.com/martweb/pug_info_2.htm Scroll down to "background template name labels" and click the info icon. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 13 Feb 2008 18:01 from: Gordon S click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Thanks for the reply Martin. I must have been blind because I never saw the file name.....sure you didn't add it to the latest update? The pad names issue was a like to have, rather than a must have. No problem using the end key....(now I've found it! ) |
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posted: 4 Mar 2008 04:09 from: NGT_Models
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Martin, You know..., what would be great is a way to save an individual's settings as default. I like the dark grey screen with my own colour sleepers and rails. Each time I start, I need to re-set all this. Haven't missed this, too, have I? Zoë Topper NGTmodels@aim.com http://www.ngtmodels.com http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NA_16mm_SM/ NGT Models 1816 Vermont Avenue Lansing, MI 48906 517-485-9104 |
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posted: 4 Mar 2008 04:39 from: Martin Wynne
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NGT_Models wrote: You know..., what would be great is a way to save an individual's settings as default. Hi Zoë, No you haven't. Several users have asked for this, and I have just purchased an XML component to that end. So it's on the list. I do have very strong reservations about it, though, which is why I've dragged my feet on it for years. At the very least it will mean yet another click during start-up -- there's no way I will make it a default. You will have to click something to restore your own settings. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 4 Mar 2008 04:47 from: NGT_Models
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Martin Wynne wrote: Martin, I think that's all we could wish for..., it would be nice to be able to save that little task down to one button. Looking forward to that! Zoë |
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posted: 29 Sep 2008 17:16 from: Richard Spratt
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Martin Wynne wrote:Dear all, Do I need to backup the old version before upgrading? I'm finding increasingly that I have to for most software as I'm stuck with XP SP1 |
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posted: 29 Sep 2008 18:15 from: Martin Wynne
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Richard Spratt wrote:Do I need to backup the old version before upgrading?Hi Richard, No, you can just install 091c straight off and carry on regardless. But don't try to upgrade while Templot is actually running. You can have as many different versions of Templot on your computer as you wish, and use whichever one you want at any time. If you want to do that, re-name the existing C:\TEMPLOT\TemplotZero.exe program file to something else, e.g. TemplotZero82d.exe , before running the 091c install. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 19 Jan 2009 12:51 from: Martin Wynne
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Just bumping this topic to the top of the Recent Topics list again. A reminder that the most recent Pug version 091c can be downloaded from: 091c download . Full details at: 091c info . Martin. |
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posted: 10 Jul 2009 12:49 from: m davies click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Hi, just tried to install 0.91c and Templot fails to load with this resultant error AppName: templotzero 0.91c.exe AppVer: 0.91.3.1001 ModName: kernel32.dll ModVer: 5.1.2600.5781 Offset: 00012afb Having saved the original and then restored TemplotZero it all works again, Its a long shot, does 0.91c need a printer driver to boot ?, 0.74b doesn't, it just sends up a nag box saying it cannot find one and then continues, 0.91c doesn't even boot up. Thanks in advance. Kindest Michael |
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posted: 10 Jul 2009 17:55 from: Martin Wynne
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m davies wrote: It's a long shot, does 0.91c need a printer driver to boot ?Hi Michael, YES ! See the very first message in this topic, from which I quote: A new pug version 091c is available if you would like to try it: Click to Download ( Just a reminder that Templot needs a default local printer -- not a network printer -- to be able to run. A physical printer is not necessary, only the printer driver is needed. A virtual printer such as a fax driver or PDF generator will do fine. A free PDF printer driver can be downloaded from: http://www.pdf995.com/download.html ) regards, Martin. |
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posted: 10 Jul 2009 18:44 from: m davies click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Martin, I suspected so, I just wanted to make sure before going to the back of the loft where the really big spiders are to drag the printer out and its drivers disc, the pdf ones linked in here didn't download for some reason, my security set up somewhere I'm sure. As an aside, even with printer drivers loaded it still failed, turns out you need print spooler activated in MS services, I'm one of these people who hunt down unnecessary services and turn them off to improve PC performance and loop holes for hackers. Anyway, 'tis' all working tickity boo now, thank you. Kindest Michael |
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posted: 28 Aug 2009 19:35 from: Roger click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Hi As a complete novice to this lark can I just say that the tutorials are excellent. So good in fact that after only a week playing about I have managed to scan in a background plan for Edington Junction (ex S&D) and overlay it with a complete set of templates. Just needs a few minor tweeks. Brilliant!! Regards Roger |
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posted: 1 Sep 2009 10:20 from: Stephen Freeman
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Hi, Do I take then if on a network a printer connected to another computer on the network doesn't count either? Also if you have a printer driver installed can you then also print to a Network Printer as well? Martin Wynne wrote: m davies wrote:It's a long shot, does 0.91c need a printer driver to boot ?Hi Michael, |
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posted: 1 Sep 2009 11:26 from: Martin Wynne
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Borg-Rail wrote: Do I take then if on a network a printer connected to another computer on the network doesn't count either?Hi Stephen, You can print to a network printer instead of a local printer -- provided it is switched on and available for use before you start Templot. Templot builds a list of printer information during startup. It must find at least one printer, otherwise it can't start. If it's a local printer only the driver program is needed -- the printer itself doesn't have to be switched on, or connected, or even exist. This is needed for the printer calibration functions, and also to enable the page outlines on the pad. If you don't have a local printer driver, the easiest solution is to install one. Any printer driver from the Windows CD will do, you don't need the actual printer. Or simply download a free one, such as one of the many PDF generator programs (which are virtual printers). At one time Windows came with a virtual printer already installed -- the Fax modem. But that seems to have fallen by the wayside. I made the mistake in writing the code years ago of assuming that it would always be available, at the least. In future Templot will have its own PDF generator, which will provide the default "printer" during startup if none other is available. It seems to be a failing in Windows that there is no fall-back default driver for the Print functions to use. The obvious solution would be to "print" to the screen. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 2 Sep 2009 08:30 from: richard_t
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OT: But I remember old versions of Word behaving very oddly if no printer was installed - back in Windows 3.1 days. I think you only got one font, even though Windows had loads installed, and not until you installed a printer did you get the rest of them. Happy days (or not!) |
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posted: 10 Sep 2009 22:45 from: Roger Stone click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Hi Martin, Pug 091c seems to have stopped working for me. I had it running until yesterday when I was hit by malicious software which necessitated reformating my hard drive and reloading everything. I reloaded 0.74b and then reloaded 0.91c on top. Now at startup it displays the "Templot will be starting soon" window and then displays Microsoft's error message "Templot has encountered a problem and needs to close....." I have tried uninstlling templot and downloading and reloading both versions. I can now run 0.74b (renamed as TemplotZero74b.exe) but 091c still won't run. I am using Win XP Pro on an IBM laptop. Regards Roger |
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posted: 10 Sep 2009 23:26 from: Martin Wynne
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Roger Stone wrote: Pug 091c seems to have stopped working for me.Hi Roger, You need to install a printer driver. Use the CD which came with your printer. But if you don't have a printer, you don't need the actual printer. Just do this: From the Windows taskbar: Start > Control Panel > Printers and Faxes > Add Printer. See previous messages in this topic. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 11 Sep 2009 19:21 from: Roger Stone click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Martin Wynne wrote:
Thanks Martin, I had already loaded the printer drivers so I was looking everywhere else. It seems that I had to have the printer actually connected the first time round so that the OS can enumerate the USB connection to the printer and make the correct associations for the driver. Regards Roger |
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posted: 20 Jan 2010 07:17 from: kenbec
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Martin Wynne wrote: Dear all,Hello, I am starting to work my way through Templot 0.74b using the Templot Companion as a guide. However I have become aware of two things. Firstly every section of the Templot Companion has a line at the end saying "more notes here soon" and most are dated somewhere between Sep 2005 and April 2007. Secondly the latest version 091c was released 07.02.2008 which makes it very nearly 2 years in use, and there have been at least 2 important releases between 0.74b and 091c. My questions are:- 1. Is there a later version of the Templot Companion associated with 091c? and 2. Why have I been set to work on 0.74b when it was released in Oct 2001? I am sure there is a reason for all this I would just like to know what it is or have I somehow got off on the wrong track? All the best, ken |
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posted: 20 Jan 2010 08:49 from: Martin Wynne
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Kenneth Beckett wroteI am sure there is a reason for all this I would just like to know what it is or have I somehow got off on the wrong track?Hi Ken, I tried to explain the situation in your order confirmation email. You may want to go back and read it again. The basic problem is that there is 10 times more work in creating the help notes, tutorials, videos and documentation for a computer program than there is in writing the program itself. And then keeping it all up to date while the program is constantly developing is another massive task. There is also a sensible limit to how many hours a day it is wise to spend sitting at a computer without damaging your health. I know that I have exceeded that limit in recent years and I am beginning to feel the effects. So now I try to be sensible. Had I known all this, and the detailed level of support which users would require, I very much doubt that I would have released Templot in the first place. It started life 30 years ago as a program for my own use -- you can read some background to that here (this in itself is a 10-year-old web page): http://www.templot.com/martweb/templot_history.htm For example, the Templot Companion section of the web site contains about 400 screenshots in all. Every time I make a change in the menus or upgrade the program, a great many of those need to be re-done and the accompanying notes revised. Again and again as the program develops. It's just not possible. It's especially not possible when 90% of my Templot time nowadays is not spent on developing the program or writing the documentation -- it is spent on user support. Answering emails and preparing replies on here (such as this one ). Often that means preparing videos and screenshots -- it takes a lot of time doing those and double checking that every word I write is correct and accurately describes the working of Templot.I therefore made a decision that I would leave version 074b set in stone, so to speak, with its matching documentation, as the initial release version for users. Those who want more can follow the pug upgrades as I make them available, but would need to put up with some patchy help notes and find their own way round the menus as things get changed and moved about. In hindsight that situation has lasted far too long, and it would have been very much better had it been 078e as the initial release. Also the F7 snapping functions introduced in 082d are ideal for beginners but of less use for experienced users. The constant dilemma is whether to spend my time on new program features, some of which have been half-finished for years and for which many users have been waiting a long time. Or on a better system of help notes and videos for new users to get them straight up to date on the later versions. On many days doing either would be a luxury as all my time is spent on user support and emails. So we are where we are. Stumbling forward into a new decade in not much better shape than the last one. Sorry about that. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 20 Jan 2010 11:31 from: kenbec
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Martin Wynne wrote: Kenneth Beckett wroteHello Martin,I am sure there is a reason for all this I would just like to know what it is or have I somehow got off on the wrong track?Hi Ken, Obviously I touched a sensitive nerve. Your answer possibly demonstrates where your problems start. An appropriate answer would have been:-
I don't know where you got the idea that I wanted you to spend more time at the computer, until the last few days I had no idea what was involved in your commitment to the system. My understanding was that the Templot Club was a self help forum for the users. Instead you seem to answer nearly all the questions personally. If we are going into history maybe I should say that in 1964 I was dragged out of one of the operating departments of a rather large company and, with one other colleague was given the task of putting the whole organisation on to a computer by the time of decimal currency day in Feb 1966. We didn't know enough to realise this was impossible so we went ahead and did it anyway. We programmed in machine language and assembler. While doing this we installed a computer as big as a house with tape drives as the only storage medium. I oversaw the early operation of this computer until I was appointed to the position of Information Systems Director. Now to the point of my story, after a couple of years of truly exhilarating work as a programmer and several more as Operations Manager I was suddenly in charge of a department with a couple of hundred people looking to me to give them answers and guidance. Before this everything had been run pretty much on an ad hoc basis. I found myself arriving at work by 06.00 hrs. and lucky to leave by 20.00 hrs. One day I said to myself “enough” and from then on I organised myself to set priorities and to deal with one thing at a time until I had completed the task. This is a bit of an oversimplification, emergencies always took precedence. You should do the same, decide what it is you want to get completed and concentrate on that. Obviously you will not be able to spend all the time you presently do answering questions on this forum. Aren't there enough experienced users to take up the slack? If there aren't, or there are a lot of queries because of deficiencies in the documentation, this should give you a guide to what your priorities should be. Good documentation plus a pool of experienced users = Martin with enough time to do the programming he wants to. I developed a firm rule which went. A good program with inadequate documentation = an inadequate program. A poor program with inadequate documentation = a disaster. Your program appears to be excellent, I leave it to you whether you are satisfied with the documentation or not. In your answer you refer to my questions as an example of what takes up your time, please see the first few lines of my reply. As to your regret that you ever released Templot I think the railway modelling fraternity would be the worse off if you had not. Anyway as a 73 year old I can't spend too much time on Templot, if it takes too long for me to grasp I will have to go back to Peco turnouts and a somewhat inferior result. I really would like to see my layout finished regards ken |
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posted: 20 Jan 2010 12:51 from: Martin Wynne
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Hi Ken, Many thanks for your thoughtful comments. Obviously I touched a sensitive nerve.Sorry if it read that way, I didn't intend it. An appropriate answer would have been:-Indeed it would. But I had already explained exactly that in my order confirmation email to you. I thought you were looking for some further background to the situation. My understanding was that the Templot Club was a self help forum for the users. Instead you seem to answer nearly all the questions personally.I try not to -- it is intended to be a discussion forum. For the "share and show my track plan" type of topic I do tend to leave it to others. But on Templot itself, often I am the only one who can give a full answer. Even so, quite often a member's contributions go completely ignored or unanswered -- look at these topics for example: topic 1010 topic 987 I developed a firm rule which went. A good program with inadequate documentation = an inadequate program.Unfortunately the number of employees here at Templot Towers can be counted on 1/5th of one hand. So you can have a good program, or good documentation, but not both. Or at least, not yet. We are still on Version Zero of Templot. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 20 Jan 2010 12:59 from: polybear click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Following on from this Martin, would it be useful for you to run a poll of the group to establish what priority Templot users put on the various upgrade ideas you currently wish to implement into the program (e.g. implementing a PDF Printer within Templot)? Obviously some work that you wish to carry out may not lend itself to such a poll very well (for example, if there are program bug fixes that are totally lost to some of us lesser mortals that don't understand computer hocus-pocus ).One of the line items in the poll could well be the upgrade of user tutorials perhaps, though I fully appreciate there are problems here because ideally I imagine you don't want to spend too much time upgrading tutorials until you reach V1.00 of Templot? The results of the poll may well allow you to prioritise your workload better, as suggested by Ken. If you are able to consider Templot users on the Forum as your "Workforce" and hopefully take some of the workload off you with respect to answering queries I'm sure that would help you out a lot; though obviously there will be questions that will require your expertise. HTH Best Regards, Brian Tulley |
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posted: 20 Jan 2010 18:04 from: Paul Boyd
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Brian Tulley wrote:If you are able to consider Templot users on the Forum as your "Workforce" and hopefully take some of the workload off you with respect to answering queries I'm sure that would help you out a lot; though obviously there will be questions that will require your expertise.The latter is certainly true, but I must admit that I sometimes feel a little guilty about not stepping in sometimes and answering questions that I can. I consider myself reasonably experienced on Templot (but I'm always learning!) so should be able to help more. I'm not sure I can blame major upheaval last year as an excuse any more! Having said that, sometimes I feel that people asking the questions don't appear to be doing anything to help themselves - or if they are then they don't say so. For instance, and with no reference to any actual questions, someone may ask something like "I want a triple-tandem double-flanged track formation - how do I do it?" rather than "I want a triple-tandem double-flanged track formation. I read through the tutorials and got as far as xyz but I didn't understand what was meant by "confabulating the notch" and got a tandem-triple turnout instead - could someone please help me?" On other occasions, it's so obvious that the questioner hasn't attempted to understand even the absolute basics that I just know that I'll regret diving in to help. Having re-read that last paragraph, it sounds a bit off - sorry about that! I know every Templot user had to start somewhere, but as I've said before I was getting nowhere until I worked through the tutorials. Personally, I think doing that should be mandatory It doesn't mean you'll know all the answers, but you'll know the right questions to ask!Anyway, I'll see if I can help out a bit more in future |
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posted: 20 Jan 2010 21:44 from: Ian Bunch click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Hi all. Hopefully someone knows the answer to this. I have been reinstalling 0.91c on my laptop under windoze 7 (still lousy) and everything runs fine. (This is on a MacBookPro and Parallels 5) What I can't seem to work out (or remember) is how to get my printer to work with Templot. It works with all the other Windows detritus but not with Templot (the sole reason for the refugee OS on my machine) It worked fine on my previous iMac installation but I'm sure I created some special setting to run my printer through, but this was an XP setup. Which ever port I set my printer to Templot returns an 'invalid port' pop up. Help Ian |
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posted: 24 Jan 2010 20:14 from: mfsyoung
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I use a Mac with Parallel, but with XP as I see no need to upgrade to something not proven. Anyway, I do not have any problems connecting to the printer (which is on another computer), maybe this is a Windows 7 thing! I did not have to set a port but just set up a printer as normal on the XP desktop. Hope this helps Michael. |
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posted: 2 Jun 2010 10:03 from: Simon Dunkley
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Ian Bunch wrote: Hi all.I am using Parallels 4 and Vista on my Mac: like you, the only reason for this is Templot. I have found that if I restart my printer, I get an option to connect to the Mac or the virtual machine, and use the latter. However, this only seems to work if the printer is physically connected to the Mac. It is on a wireless network (more than one computer in the house), but the scanner component doesn't want to talk wirelessly, so there is a cabled connection present and this is no hardship to me. Sorry this may be a bit late in the day, but I only noticed your post in this thread today! Simon |
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posted: 2 Jun 2010 11:06 from: Martin Wynne
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Simon Dunkley wrote:I have found that if I restart my printer, I get an option to connect to the Mac or the virtual machine, and use the latter.Hi Simon, It's important to make sure that any printer you intend to use in Templot is either a Windows local printer, or is switched on and ready for use before you start Templot. Templot creates a list of available printers during its start-up, to allow for the printer calibration data. Most other Windows programs don't have printer calibration functions. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 2 Jun 2010 11:15 from: Simon Dunkley
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Thanks Martin. Interesting, as I haven't had any problems in that respect, well, not usually - sometimes Templot doesn't recognise the printer, but normally it does. This has worked fine for printing small percentage plans, but I haven't tried anything bigger for a while. The bigger problem I have is that for some reason the print spooler is not running in Windows, and I cannot install Win2PDF, so that I can go straight to pdf files. (MS website suggested starting services in control panel, but that is not there, either!) Simon |
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posted: 2 Jun 2010 11:39 from: Martin Wynne
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Simon Dunkley wrote:The bigger problem I have is that for some reason the print spooler is not running in Windows, and I cannot install Win2PDF, so that I can go straight to pdf files.Hi Simon, The next version of Templot can create PDF files natively, you won't need Win2PDF or similar virtual printers. They can be set as very large PDFs for wide-format roll paper printing. The image dimensions are set directly and not referenced to any printer paper sheet sizes. I'm not aware of any reason this won't work on a Mac, but only time will tell. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 2 Jun 2010 13:41 from: Simon Dunkley
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Martin Wynne wrote:I'm not aware of any reason this won't work on a Mac, but only time will tell.I'd be more than happy to try it out, if you so wish. Simon |
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posted: 7 Jul 2011 17:20 from: Martin Wynne
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Just bumping this back into the Recent Topics list. |
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posted: 21 Jul 2011 22:26 from: rmschmidt click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Dear Martin I have an old version of Templot on an old laptop. I have recently upgraded both laptop and O/S so that I'm now running Windows 7 - which version of Templot should I download. As far as I recall the Pugs had to be added on to existing programs, but maybe I have got that round my neck. Some guidance if you have a moment? Best wishes Richard Schmidt |
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posted: 21 Jul 2011 23:32 from: Martin Wynne
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Hi Richard, I'm sorry the situation is a little confusing. It all stems from the fact that I don't have the time and resources to update the tutorials and documentation AND upgrade the program at the same time. It has to be one or the other. You can have as many different versions of Templot on your computer as you wish, and use whichever you prefer at any time. Just install each one in its own folder. At present you should install version 074b first, as only this one creates a desktop shortcut. You can then upgrade it to 091c if you wish. The version of Windows which you are using is irrelevant. Note however, that unlike 074b, version 091c won't run if you don't have a default local printer installed. Which to use? Well 091c is 10 times better than 074b and has many more features. It's only 3 years old whereas 074b is now 10 years old. The snag is that it doesn't match the documentation and static tutorials on the web site. The menus are different. So if you want to follow the tutorials and learn the basics it makes sense to do that using 074b. Then upgrade to 091c to use Templot for real. On the other hand 091c does match the videos. So if you prefer to learn by watching the videos rather than reading the docs, upgrade to 091c immediately. Waiting in the wings is a third option, the Templot Development Version (TDV). You can use that now if you wish, by joining the purple group on here. It's unfinished and contains no documentation at all, but it has a further great many new features, the most significant being support for irregular diamond-crossings. In due course it will be released to replace 091c, but when I will have the time to create an updated set of documentation for it, heaven only knows. Most keen Templot users probably have all 3 versions on their computer, and use whichever seems appropriate for the task in hand. regards, Martin. |
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posted: 4 Oct 2011 18:33 from: Steve Carter click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Martin Wynne wrote: The next version of Templot can create PDF files natively, you won't need Win2PDF or similar virtual printers. Is this now working or am I missing something? I have version 091c and have just managed to complete my track plan. I am now ready to take a PDF file along to a shop to have it printed out on a roll that I can then use to build my trackwork. Can anyone help by explaining how to do this please? Many thanks Steve |
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| Last edited on 4 Oct 2011 18:34 by Steve Carter |
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posted: 4 Oct 2011 18:46 from: Martin Wynne
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Steve Carter wrote: Hi Steve, Large-format PDF output is available in the Templot Development Version (TDV). And lots of other new features. To get TDV you need to be a member of the development group, which you are very welcome to join. Details: topic 1510 regards, Martin. |
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posted: 4 Oct 2011 19:17 from: Steve Carter click the date to link to this post click member name to view archived images |
Thank you Martin I'll be moving over to sign up very shortly. Regards Steve |
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