What printer should I get ?

[Phil G]

Poached is more of a simmer!

correct you may pass

 

[David Lane]

I am thinking about getting a FDM printer reading though the above I am tempted with the Kingroon or would it be better to spend a bit more money say around £250 and get a Neptune or are there other printers I should look at.
David

 

[Hayfield]

I have encountered a problem with trying to design and print an A inner rh filing jig. I designed one and printed it from an A6 template once printed it turned out to be a B inner rh jig. Thought I made a mistake so created a 2nd file (changing the name by adding 2 to the title so I did not select the wrong file) After meshing it showed B switch. For design 3 I used a new template after clearing the screen and tried a third time. Same thing happened

What an I doing wrong !!

John

 

[KHC1]

Ask around I have an Ender 3 pro that works fine for me. However I did need to get my son-in-law to help with the set up and I can also bounce problems with him as he has the same printer. I know that there will be people out there who will say I have got the wrong printer but it works for me. I also use it for other projects as well.

Keith

 

[Martin Wynne]

I have encountered a problem with trying to design and print an A inner rh filing jig. I designed one and printed it from an A6 template once printed it turned out to be a B inner rh jig. Thought I made a mistake so created a 2nd file (changing the name by adding 2 to the title so I did not select the wrong file) After meshing it showed B switch. For design 3 I used a new template after clearing the screen and tried a third time. Same thing happened

What an I doing wrong !!

John

@Hayfield

Hi John,

Have you accidentally clicked the wrong radio button:

The left-hand button creates a jig to match the current control template.

The right-hand button lets you create a filing jig for any switch angle by changing the setting. The default there is 1:32, which is a B switch. An A switch is 1:24.

cheers,

Martin.

 

[Phil G]

I have an Ender 3 pro that works fine for me.

Hi Keith,
Out of interest what print settings profile, are you using on your ender 3 pro?
cheers
Phil

 

[KHC1]

Hi Phil there is not a one simple answer to the profile. I have set up profiles for various situations. Firstly I in the main use the Prusa slicer but also have Cura downloaded. Martin has made the files available for use for both Track and filing jigs for Cursa. I have transposed Martins settings in to Prusa for Track. When i get around too it I will try to do the same for the filing jigs etc.

As to my FDM printer as with any FDM machine its all about bed levelling. I did struggle for some time but now with a couple of modifications I have near perfect levelling every print. With my son-in-laws help i now have a CR touch fitted and use a PEI plate. With the CR touch once the bed was levelled this now does a 24 point depth test on the bed and automatically compensates for imperfections of the bed this occurs every time the machine is set to print. It is now a case of switch on go for print and walk away. Before you had to watch the first few minutes to ensure everything was OK. The other change is the PEI build plate. This replaces the original magnetic plate and seams to have better adhesion properties. With the Ender you do have to add glue to the build plate for adhesion. The original magnetic plate was also good for adhesion but frequently you had to use a scrapper to remove items. Every time you used the scraper this would affect the levelling. Now with the PEI plate you just wait for the bed to cool down to below 30 degrees and items just pull off with little effort and the levelling remains in place. As I am writing this I have a 3hr 20min print of a DEMU roof printing yet all i did was switch on load the print and come back into the warm for a cup of tea. And yes I did play with the slicer settings as this print is an experiment.

Keith

 

[Hayfield]

@Hayfield

Hi John,

Have you accidentally clicked the wrong radio button:

View attachment 8154

The left-hand button creates a jig to match the current control template.

The right-hand button lets you create a filing jig for any switch angle by changing the setting. The default there is 1:32, which is a B switch. An A switch is 1:24.

cheers,

Martin.

Martin

Thanks, yes it was ticked and I am hoping it will do it, but its difficult to see whether its an A or B in cura

 

[Phil G]

Hi Phil there is not a one simple answer to the profile. I have set up profiles for various situations. Firstly I in the main use the Prusa slicer but also have Cura downloaded. Martin has made the files available for use for both Track and filing jigs for Cursa. I have transposed Martins settings in to Prusa for Track. When i get around too it I will try to do the same for the filing jigs etc.

As to my FDM printer as with any FDM machine its all about bed levelling. I did struggle for some time but now with a couple of modifications I have near perfect levelling every print. With my son-in-laws help i now have a CR touch fitted and use a PEI plate. With the CR touch once the bed was levelled this now does a 24 point depth test on the bed and automatically compensates for imperfections of the bed this occurs every time the machine is set to print. It is now a case of switch on go for print and walk away. Before you had to watch the first few minutes to ensure everything was OK. The other change is the PEI build plate. This replaces the original magnetic plate and seams to have better adhesion properties. With the Ender you do have to add glue to the build plate for adhesion. The original magnetic plate was also good for adhesion but frequently you had to use a scrapper to remove items. Every time you used the scraper this would affect the levelling. Now with the PEI plate you just wait for the bed to cool down to below 30 degrees and items just pull off with little effort and the levelling remains in place. As I am writing this I have a 3hr 20min print of a DEMU roof printing yet all i did was switch on load the print and come back into the warm for a cup of tea. And yes I did play with the slicer settings as this print is an experiment.

Keith

Hi Keith,
I tend to agree with everything you have said, and to be honest there the key advantages you get with the Neptune 3 pro as standard.
Do you have a single Z leadscrew as fitted? I fitted a second one, and to be honest I now think that made it a bit worse if anything.
The Neptune also has two lead screws on the the Z, but importantly its also has a toothed belt ensuring they micro step together. (I found a clone of this belt arrangements on AliExpress, so we will see when it gets to me if its any good on the ender or not.)
which if you watch the timing belt on the Neptune closely, you can see there slightly moving all the time.
Its not helped with me breaking the ender hot end as well, that's fixed now though. A good thing about enders there lots of replacement parts readily to hand.

re slicers I am pondering weather to have a dabble with Orca slicer, its getting some very good reviews, it seems to be fork on top of a fork from the Prusa slicer. supposed to have all the advantages claimed of Prusa, but also all the ease of loading new machines settings and profiles, you get with Cura, so they say. Have you head of it?
cheers
Phil

 

[Phil G]

but its difficult to see whether its an A or B in cura

Hi John,
If you use the scroll wheel on the mouse in Cura you can zoom right in, then hold down the right mouse button and you can orbit. By using a combination of both you can get right in and read the legend printed on the item
as per photo attached
cheers
Phil

Attachments​

• 
  close up of B switch.jpg
  186.1 KB · Views: 0

 

[Martin Wynne]

Martin

Thanks, yes it was ticked and I am hoping it will do it, but its difficult to see whether its an A or B in cura

@Hayfield

Hi John,

After clicking Slice in Cura, click Preview at the top of the screen:

Then on the menus click View > Camera position > Top view. Roll the mouse wheel if you need to zoom in.

You can then read the size of blade quite easily. Above is an A blade jig. Below is a B blade jig:

I'm sorry it isn't clearer. I tried for ages to get a clearer way of showing the sizes, but you have to bear in mind that the jigs can be created for any switch angle, not just the limited range of REA switches. FDM printing isn't good for text.

cheers,

Martin.

 

[Hayfield]

Thank you both, I am just finishing printing the A switch rh front, I just need a B switch lh front to complete both sets.

The problem was that I had difficulty reading the jigs and if I enlarged them the writing went behind a dialog box, another learning experiance

 

[Martin Wynne]

The problem was that I had difficulty reading the jigs and if I enlarged them the writing went behind a dialog box, another learning experiance

@Hayfield

Hi John,

If you mean in Cura, you can move the image around from behind other things by holding down the mouse wheel and moving the mouse.

cheers,

Martin.

 

[Steve_Cornford]

I find it useful to use the [preview 3D] button that invokes 3D-Tool viewing utility.

Easy to zoom etc.
Steve

 

[Hayfield]

Appologies for going off topic

A couple of comments on RMweb were on the lines of once you build the track, what do you do with the printers

Well a contact asked about how big a piece could you build on my little Kingroon, he sent me one file of an 183mm long model of a station waiting room and a short test piece. Firstly would it fit on my Kingroon with 180mm square bed, I had no idea what to do other than first mesh fix the file then import it in Cura, as I knew it would tell you when it would not fit on the bed

Well at 183mm it did not, but I remembered how we printed an oversize item diagonally (I do listen in class). Firstly I stood it upright from laying on its back by turning it 90 degrees, then I turned it 45 degrees diagonally and it fitted on the build plate. However the complete model (less roof) would take13 hours and 18 mins to print and use 138 grams of filament. So I thought about printing the much smaller test piece I was sent

Again the drawing was on its back and I thought I doubt if could could be printed that way round owing to the 2 rear protrusions. So with the file in in Cura after a bit of fiddling I managed to get it upright and thought I would use the jig settings as it was much the same size as a jig side

It started printing fine and was due to take 1hr 39 mins and use 15 grams of filament (30p) this is it at 50%

At 75% and I was wondering how it would fair when it got to the top of the door and windows, would they droop

At 100% and 2 hrs and 9 mins

Well it printed and I have got the answer to the persons question, "what to do with the printers once the track is built" simple carry on building other things !!!

OK someone designed the test piece, and I lucked out first time printing it without really knowing what I was doing, another great tool at our disposal

 

[Phil G]

Appologies for going off topic

A couple of comments on RMweb were on the lines of once you build the track, what do you do with the printers

Well a contact asked about how big a piece could you build on my little Kingroon, he sent me one file of an 183mm long model of a station waiting room and a short test piece. Firstly would it fit on my Kingroon with 180mm square bed, I had no idea what to do other than first mesh fix the file then import it in Cura, as I knew it would tell you when it would not fit on the bed

Well at 183mm it did not, but I remembered how we printed an oversize item diagonally (I do listen in class). Firstly I stood it upright from laying on its back by turning it 90 degrees, then I turned it 45 degrees diagonally and it fitted on the build plate. However the complete model (less roof) would take13 hours and 18 mins to print and use 138 grams of filament. So I thought about printing the much smaller test piece I was sent

Again the drawing was on its back and I thought I doubt if could could be printed that way round owing to the 2 rear protrusions. So with the file in in Cura after a bit of fiddling I managed to get it upright and thought I would use the jig settings as it was much the same size as a jig side

View attachment 8166

It started printing fine and was due to take 1hr 39 mins and use 15 grams of filament (30p) this is it at 50%

View attachment 8167

At 75% and I was wondering how it would fair when it got to the top of the door and windows, would they droop

View attachment 8168 At 100% and 2 hrs and 9 mins

Well it printed and I have got the answer to the persons question, "what to do with the printers once the track is built" simple carry on building other things !!!

OK someone designed the test piece, and I lucked out first time printing it without really knowing what I was doing, another great tool at our disposal

You must have a wonder printer. You don't seem to have any visible layers at all.
By the way the the answer to drooping at gaps, IE doors and windows is supports. That's a whole new world of Cura settings for you.
also you don't need to print the whole thing in one go if it will not fit on your bed.

 

[Martin Wynne]

Martin

Thanks, yes it was ticked and I am hoping it will do it, but its difficult to see whether its an A or B in cura

@Hayfield

Hi John,

I have rearranged some code so that this dialog can now show the size of the jig before you create it, and can be cancelled if wrong:

Will be in the next program update.

cheers,

Martin.

 

[Hayfield]

Thanks that will be of a great help, I dont know how I unknowing changed the settings, but I nearly have a set of B filing jigs which is no bad thing

 

[Hayfield]

You must have a wonder printer. You don't seem to have any visible layers at all.
By the way the the answer to drooping at gaps, IE doors and windows is supports. That's a whole new world of Cura settings for you.
also you don't need to print the whole thing in one go if it will not fit on your bed.

Its the small Kingroon printer and as I said I had no idea what I was doing other than using the methods Martin and the rest of you have shown me, plus the design skills of David

 

[Hayfield]

Sorry to be a pain yet again, but have I actually sliced this file ? I cannot remember hitting a slice button, but I seem to have stumbled through it


And yes I am about to start resin printing

John

 

[Martin Wynne]

Sorry to be a pain yet again, but have I actually sliced this file ? I cannot remember hitting a slice button, but I seem to have stumbled through it


And yes I am about to start resin printing


View attachment 10143

John

@Hayfield

Hi John,

If that is the file which I posted here ALK_s1_mixed_4mm_fixed.ctb it was already sliced and ready to use on the Alkaid printer.

Slicing it again will cause errors.

Just copy it onto a USB stick and put it in the printer.

The download is here:

https://85a.uk/templot/club/posts/9640

My post with a guide to using the Alkaid printer is at:

https://85a.uk/templot/club/posts/9658

---

CTB files are already sliced.

STL files need slicing to create a CTB file.

cheers,

Martin.

 

[KHC1]

Well done John I have just finished setting up my Alkaid. I did run into one problem. I went to put in the two resin tank locating screws and one went in fine and looked exactly as they do in Jameses video. The second one would only go in just a few turns and would not go any further. Firstly I tried cleaning the tread and then a light file but to no improvement. Email sent to Geeetech but no reply as yet. But a visit to screwfix and a packet of M4 bolts came home. First one out of the packet fitted so packed out with a couple of nuts and washers and temporary used in place until a replacement comes.

Now just got to set up a washing station and pour in some resin.

Keith

 

[Hayfield]

@Hayfield

Hi John,

If that is the file which I posted here ALK_s1_mixed_4mm_fixed.ctb it was already sliced and ready to use on the Alkaid printer.

Slicing it again will cause errors.

Just copy it onto a USB stick and put it in the printer.

The download is here:

https://85a.uk/templot/club/posts/9640

My post with a guide to using the Alkaid printer is at:

https://85a.uk/templot/club/posts/9658

---

CTB files are already sliced.

STL files need slicing to create a CTB file.

cheers,

Martin.

Martin

I must have got confused with a reply from a couple of months ago, my bad memory. I will load up the tank in the week and see how it comes out. I must make a start with printing the chairs as I need some samples for Scaleforum in September

 

[Hayfield]

My post with a guide to using the Alkaid printer is at:

I have this guide printed for quite a few weeks, next job is to fashion up a black out blind. Then should be ready to go

John

 

[Martin Wynne]

My post with a guide to using the Alkaid printer is at:

I have this guide printed for quite a few weeks, next job is to fashion up a black out blind. Then should be ready to go

John

@Hayfield

Hi John,

UV forecast for your area today:

By 4pm today it is down to 1 and by 7pm it is down to zero. Just drawing the curtains should be sufficient if you quickly get the yellow lid on after filling the tank, and get the print washed quickly.

An ordinary light bulb is ok if not too close, but no fluorescent tubes.

cheers,

Martin.

 

[Hayfield]

Thanks but I still don't have any curtains, its an east facing window, but I do have some black plastic sheeting/card

 

[Martin Wynne]

Thanks but I still don't have any curtains, its an east facing window, but I do have some black plastic sheeting/card

@Hayfield

Hi John,

I don't know how effective this stuff would be:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07P871SYL

Anyone?

Martin.

 

[Hayfield]

Thanks, but my wife has offered to make me some, trouble is what I wanted prior to getting the printer would not do the job as I wanted either Roman blinds or a curtain half way up the window

Now a full blackout type is required

 

[Martin Wynne]

Thanks, but my wife has offered to make me some, trouble is what I wanted prior to getting the printer would not do the job as I wanted either Roman blinds or a curtain half way up the window

Now a full blackout type is required

@Hayfield

Hi John,

You could just do your printing late at night?

What UV are you using for curing?

cheers,

Martin.

 

[Hayfield]

I am using a gel nail machine, how long do I need them under the light, do they need turning over half way through

 

[Steve_Cornford]

Hi John,
A Roman blind with a blackout lining should be ok .
That's what I have got.
Steve

 

[Martin Wynne]

I am using a gel nail machine, how long do I need them under the light, do they need turning over half way through

@Hayfield

Hi John,

Yes to turning them over. If you place them on some crumpled kitchen foil it should help to reflect the UV all round them. Wear red safety glasses while messing with UV.

Make sure they are fully dry before curing them (hairdryer?).

How long to cure for will depend on the strength of the UV light. While washing they are not much harder than cheese, so need to be handled gently. You will easily be able to tell when they have hardened sufficiently for normal handling. The UV has to penetrate the translucent resin, so small thin parts will need less time that thick chunky parts. For 4mm chairs I would start at say 5 minutes, then turn them over for another 5 minutes. But that's purely a guess.

They will harden further if left in daylight over the next few days, as is evidenced by the rafts gradually curling. You can prevent curling by double-stick taping them to scrap bit of wood immediately after curing. But it's not important and doesn't affect the chairs.

Even when fully hardened they can be softened in very hot water, sufficient to straighten the rafts.

For long-term storage it's better to keep them in the dark, and paint them quite soon after using them. Long-term UV exposure might make them brittle and liable to crack as it does other plastics, especially if they are a very tight fit on the rail. But no-one really knows yet what's best. We need several years experience of plug track to make definitive recommendations.

cheers,

Martin.

 

[KHC1]

Silly question time sorry. In the next day or two I can set my Alkaid printer going. I have set up and levelled the build plate as per James video and the instruction book. Do I lift the build plate and put the resin in or put the resin in the tank with the build plate down. Also when I have done a print and taken it off the build plate do I send the plate home or leave it lifted.

Keith

 

[Martin Wynne]

Silly question time sorry. In the next day or two I can set my Alkaid printer going. I have set up and levelled the build plate as per James video and the instruction book. Do I lift the build plate and put the resin in or put the resin in the tank with the build plate down. Also when I have done a print and taken it off the build plate do I send the plate home or leave it lifted.

Keith

@KHC1 @Hayfield

Hi Keith,

After levelling and tightening the 4 screws (very tight), move the build plate about 2/3rds of the way up the column using the Z buttons on the screen. Press Tools > Manual > 10mm and then Up several times. When high enough press the green back arrows to finish. Be careful because there is no limit switch at the top to stop it if you go too far. There is a reason it costs only £90.

Remove the build plate using the top knob. If you didn't give it a good clean before levelling, do it now. A good scrub under the hot tap to remove any factory dirt and finger marks, and dry it off. It needs to be kept really clean.

While it's removed, pour some resin into the tank about half full. Immediately put the build plate back on the machine and tighten the top knob firmly. Quickly put the yellow lid back on and you are ready to print. At the start of each print the machine will move the build plate down into the resin. After the print the machine will lift the build plate up high for the print to drip -- leave it dripping for about 5 minutes.

Take the yellow lid off and remove the build plate with the chairs on it. Put the yellow lid back on as soon as you can to protect the exposed resin from any stray UV light. Wash the build plate and chairs thoroughly as I described in my previous post. Likewise do the washing immediately before any of the surplus resin is exposed to any stray UV light. After washing you can relax and allow daylight again. Put the build plate and chairs somewhere warm to dry and/or use a hairdryer. When it's all dry, carefully remove the chair rafts from the build plate with a window scraper. Do it over something soft to catch them as they are still quite soft. They are now ready for UV curing.

There is no actual need to put the build plate back on the machine until you are ready to print next time. After levelling the first time, there is never normally any reason to press the Home button again or do any more levelling.

Check the chairs carefully each time to make sure they are complete with no parts missing. If so you can just leave the resin in the tank ready for next time. If you are leaving it for any length of time it's a good idea to cover the tank with some kitchen foil (or whatever) as extra UV protection. Give it a good stir with the yellow paddle provided before each printing session.

If there are any parts of the print missing they are likely to be in the tank stuck to the bottom film, so it will be necessary to clean out the tank and remove them before you can print again.

cheers,

Martin.

 

[Steve_Cornford]

Hi Martin, Keith.

With the Alkaid do you have the resin tank removed whilst levelling?
On the Mars 2 Pro I remove the resin tank whilst levelling.
Steve

 

[Martin Wynne]

Hi Martin, Keith.

With the Alkaid do you have the resin tank removed whilst levelling?
On the Mars 2 Pro I remove the resin tank whilst levelling.
Steve

@Steve_Cornford

Hi Steve,

On both I use a piece of ordinary A4 paper for levelling, with the tank out of the way.

However, the Alkaid instructions actually say to use the empty tank for levelling. This obviously ensures that you are using the correct thickness of film rather than paper which might not be. But it makes it difficult to check that you haven't dislodged the levelling while tightening the screws (by waggling the paper).

Martin.

 

[KHC1]

Thanks Martin all noted.

Keith

 

[Hayfield]

@Steve_Cornford

Hi Steve,

On both I use a piece of ordinary A4 paper for levelling, with the tank out of the way.

However, the Alkaid instructions actually say to use the empty tank for levelling. This obviously ensures that you are using the correct thickness of film rather than paper which might not be. But it makes it difficult to check that you haven't dislodged the levelling while tightening the screws (by waggling the paper).

Martin.

Martin

I am now confused, reading the instructions and watching several videos including James's I cannot remember seeing using a piece of paper between the tank bottom and build plate ?

Now it seems two of you are suggesting using a piece of paper, I can understand you are using it to check the build plate has nor moved during tightening up the screws, but the videos I have seen emphasize holding down the plate until all 4 screws have been tightened !!

 

[KHC1]

I have done as per Jameses video and the instructions with the machine. Martin suggested that he uses the piece of paper as I believe that is how other machines are set up.

Keith

 

[Steve_Cornford]

Hi John,
Sorry to have confused you.

You have a choice of 2 methods.

Alkaid method (as described by James) leaves tank in situ and no paper.

Mars 2 Pro method (as described in Mars 2 Pro manual) uses a sheet of paper (to represent the film thickness of the tank) with the tank removed (similar in a way to bed levelling on an FDM printer).

Just use the Alkaid method described by James and also used by Keith.

Steve